Thoughts on Wohler

mitchelwb · Jan 13, 2010

So I've looked at a ton of watches in the last couple days... I've found a lot I like, few that I've heard of, still feel like I really don't know much more now than when I started. There seems to be as many manufacturers as there are models and I just don't have any idea what is or isn't a good price on what is or isn't a good watch.

So I'm going to ask about this one. I've search for Wohler here and not found much. What little was there wasn't glowing, and was also quite old.

I'm looking at this one and just curious of other thoughts. Am I barking mad? Is this a good deal? good watch? I just don't know what to look for, and online it's even harder. Toss in ebay, and you never know if you're dealing with someone shady or not. There's just so much schlock on ebay to wade through to find the stuff you really care about.

Appreciate in advance.

gloster · Jan 13, 2010

mitchelwb said:
I'm looking at

this one and just curious of other thoughts. Am I barking mad? Is this a good deal?

$200 is way too much for this watch. If you watch eBay auctions, you should be able to get it for as little as $35 if you are patient and easily get it for $60 if you are not patient.

Wohler is a mushroom brand. That does not mean it is bad. But it does typically lower the price versus other brands.

I do not personally have a Wohler, but I have similar brands including Parnis and Jacot. As long as you pay the right price, you will get good value. You might also want to search for Rousseau, Tao, MZI, and Theorema. Those last two typically go for more like $50 - $125.

mitchelwb · Jan 13, 2010

What is a mushroom brand? is that a parent company name or a descriptive name given here?

definitely appreciate the feedback... this is what really bothers me about looking at this stuff without knowing what exactly I'm looking at. for all I know, $200 is fair for the watch, but if it's a $35 watch, I'm really more inclined to not even be interested at all in it.

AlbertaTime · Jan 13, 2010

mitchelwb said:
What is a mushroom brand? is that a parent company name or a descriptive name given here?

definitely appreciate the feedback... this is what really bothers me about looking at this stuff without knowing what exactly I'm looking at. for all I know, $200 is fair for the watch, but if it's a $35 watch, I'm really more inclined to not even be interested at all in it.

Mushroom brand is a descriptive term, and it's good you're being cautious. If you're looking for a skeleton watch in the price range about $200 or so, then this thread might be a good place to start.

You can use the search function to look for types of watches, or information on specific brands, too.

cptbluebear · Jan 13, 2010

Near as I can tell Wohler, Jacot, Eberle, Duboule, Romily, Bernoulli, Louis Richards, Rouseau and probably more are all brands owned by a mob called Always at Market. If you compare them, you'll see the same cases, hands and details appear. I assume they have them made in volume in China then feed them out through a number of associates on eBay as well as their own auction site and now Shop NBC. Think down market Invicta.

Mushroom brands are those that pop up rapidly (like mushrooms after rain) and disapear just as fast. Generally they are accompanied by a website with flashy photos, a fairytale history and massive recommended prices.

At first sight I quite like some of the Jacot and Duboule designs, but every time I look closely there is something that spoils it (like a date window clumisily cut through another dial feature). From the styling I'd guess there is one guy drawing these all up. Most are far too blingy for my taste.

What's inside? No idea, mate. Probably the same movements found in the sub-$50 eBay brands, although a couple of skeletons share a movement with Goer skeletons (can be had for $20 + postage out of HK).

If you watch eBay carefully you can find them for under US$50.

gigfy · Jan 13, 2010

This is my opinion where Wohler fits in the grand scheme of things.

Grades of Chinese watches

I wouldn't worry too much about buying one if you like it. I also agree that you can get one ~$50 if you look hard enough. And if you buy directly from Always at Market, through one of their affiliates uBid, Property Room, Always at Auction, then you can easily return it if it breaks. I am not certain about the warranty if you purchase from a reseller off of eBay. I'd check first.

Cheers,
gigfy

mitchelwb · Jan 13, 2010

This is good info. I really appreciate it. That link to the Chinese grades helps too.

At this point, I'm looking for a nice watch. it seems that there is a lot of stuff to be seen in the 30-200 range that is lower quality, overprice, and overhyped (huge MSRP), and there is a lot to drool over once you get up in the few thousand dollar range. but finding something high end affordable requires a LOT of weeding out.

My preference at this point is that I would rather pay $150 for a $150 watch than $35 for a $50 watch. I'm interested in finding something that's nice, good quality, reliable and attractive.

I'm not trying to say that I would never buy a sub-$50 watch, I just liken it more to pinball collecting (as I do just about everything in life) Some pinball machines work well as a single machine collection, but they very rarely come cheap. If you want to fill in your collection, the cheaper games are great at that because they fill a void and it's ok that they aren't as much fun because you have more to keep you from getting burned out on any one. If my analogy even makes any sense.

gloster · Jan 14, 2010

Your analogy makes perfect sense and you should check out the thread mentioned above to find the ~$200 watch you seek.

As an aside, despite the marketing fluff surrounding them and when bought at the right price, many of the eBay mushroom brands are very good values.

mitchelwb · Jan 14, 2010

I know that it seems that mushroom brands don't necessarily mean they are garbage... It's just hard for me to know though. If I was looking at buying a car, I'd know that a Porsche, or a BMW are going to be more expensive, but that they are going to be high quality cars. And I know where Toyota's, and Chevy's, and Fords, and Kia's fall in. But with all the watch brands, it's just so difficult to gauge where a brands identity lies. Sure, I know where Rolex goes... but that's out of my price range. Then there's the brands like Seiko and Citizen that I've heard of, but they have product lines that are so wide it's hard to know where any one particular watch falls. Then we have these mushrooms, that claim super high quality, that have inflated msrp's, and when you look around on the internet, you see the same watch from lots of different places for all kinds of different prices. So then, you lose a little faith in them. But to make this even more complicated, if it is a good brand, then you also have to watch out for fakes. But I can't even tell which brands are good enough to be faked yet, so I don't know when I should or shouldn't be watching for fakes, or if what I'm looking at, even though it has a price of a couple hundred dollars on it, may itself really only be a $50 watch, making it in my mind an "authentic fake"

And so far, just abot every watch I've found that I like, when I got to price compare it, I either find that I can't find the watch anywhere like I want it, or I find that the price seems to range by a factor of a few hundred percent in each direction. Does that mean crooked dealers? crooked watch makers? or both?

I have seen so many watches and some I have really liked. but what is bothering me, is that it seems about the only way to find a good quality watch is to get up to the $500 mark at least and really do your homework to know if it is or isn't a fake, or that you are buying from someone reputable. I have no problem paying a little more to buy from a reputable source, but unfortunately, it's a bit more than I'm looking to spend at this point.

I'm just so lost and confused. And I ramble.

gloster · Jan 15, 2010

Here are a few specific no-nonsense watches relatively consistently priced and from sources which are also reputable. There are many more; I just wanted to give you some specifics to cut through the clutter:

1) A Sea-Gull M182SK for $185 purchased directly from Sea-Gull's authorized US dealer, Sea-Gull Watch USA at http://www.usseagull.com/m182sk.htm

2) A Christopher Ward C5 Malvern Automatic for $315 purchased directly from Christopher Ward at http://www.christopherward-usa.com/men/dress/c5/c5swt.html#

3) A Bulova 96A100 for $224 purchased from Amazon.com, an authorized Bulova dealer, at http://www.amazon.com/Bulova-Self-Winding-Mechanical-Exhibition-96A100/dp/B0018AJIP4

These are three very different watches, but all provide good value and reputable sourcing. The Sea-Gull is the only skeleton of the group. It comes from the most respected watch company in China. It's quality is top notch. The Christopher Ward is Swiss Made with a Swiss movement and designed and sold by a highly regarded London company. I do not know the source of the Bulova movement, but finish is likely well done and service would be good.

Given what you originally said you were seeking, I think you would be very happy with the Sea-Gull. It would meet or exceed your quality expectation. Worn in the United States, it would be unique. You would know you got a good value on a luxury product. While it would take a while, you would get taken care of if something went wrong.

sbkurtz · Jan 15, 2010

You dont have to spend $500 to get a good watch.

I believe that you probably need to spend a bit more time right here on this website, esp each of the specialty forums (affordables, Seiko, diver, Chinese, etc). Take a look around and dont jump at the first thing you see. You'll quickly determine those characteristics in a watch that you value. Do you want a dive watch thats a auto or maybe a Pam homage quartz. There's also a search function here that lets you go wild once you determine what you want to look for. You can better determine fair market pricing by checking amazon and even the sales forum here. Just be patient and as long as you dont buy on a whim without educating yourself, you'll eventually find and buy what you like.

mitchelwb said:
I know that it seems that mushroom brands don't necessarily mean they are garbage... It's just hard for me to know though. If I was looking at buying a car, I'd know that a Porsche, or a BMW are going to be more expensive, but that they are going to be high quality cars. And I know where Toyota's, and Chevy's, and Fords, and Kia's fall in. But with all the watch brands, it's just so difficult to gauge where a brands identity lies. Sure, I know where Rolex goes... but that's out of my price range. Then there's the brands like Seiko and Citizen that I've heard of, but they have product lines that are so wide it's hard to know where any one particular watch falls. Then we have these mushrooms, that claim super high quality, that have inflated msrp's, and when you look around on the internet, you see the same watch from lots of different places for all kinds of different prices. So then, you lose a little faith in them. But to make this even more complicated, if it is a good brand, then you also have to watch out for fakes. But I can't even tell which brands are good enough to be faked yet, so I don't know when I should or shouldn't be watching for fakes, or if what I'm looking at, even though it has a price of a couple hundred dollars on it, may itself really only be a $50 watch, making it in my mind an "authentic fake"

And so far, just abot every watch I've found that I like, when I got to price compare it, I either find that I can't find the watch anywhere like I want it, or I find that the price seems to range by a factor of a few hundred percent in each direction. Does that mean crooked dealers? crooked watch makers? or both?

I have seen so many watches and some I have really liked. but what is bothering me, is that it seems about the only way to find a good quality watch is to get up to the $500 mark at least and really do your homework to know if it is or isn't a fake, or that you are buying from someone reputable. I have no problem paying a little more to buy from a reputable source, but unfortunately, it's a bit more than I'm looking to spend at this point.

I'm just so lost and confused. And I ramble.

cptbluebear · Jan 16, 2010

Good advice there from sbkurtz. There are some very good watches once you reach the $500 mark, but there are some good watches at much less.

At the $300 level you can find some great buys from small makers like Bernhardt and Magrette (the first two that come to mind) or bigger Japanese players like Orient and Seiko. The great thing to me about these is that, baring Seiko, you are unlikely to run into anyone else wearing one outside of WUS and if you resell them there's not much outlay to lose.

Lower down you can find some bargain Chinese, if you don't mind the slightly dodgy reputation amongst those not in the know. My first Scooby Doo was a fantastic deal from Jackson for well under $100.

Look at second hand and all bets are off. You CAN find some absolute bargains.

Hang around, check out the wrist-check threads and decide what you like. I started out liking the sort of thing you were looking at, but now I go for simple and plain (with the exception of the "Planet Orient", so it's not that clear cut). Bunging the a brand name you see into Google or the WUS search function will yeild a wealth of info and pictures - as a result of trying to source a Seiko diver I now know far too much about the history and details of these watches!

You were worried about rambling!

mitchelwb · Jan 16, 2010

cptbluebear said:
You were worried about rambling!

Don't get me started!!!!

Yeah, I see a ton of watches I like. Some I think look nice, but just not for me. Some I love, then see the price and it doesn't matter who made it, it's not for me.

The point I'm just trying to get to is that I don't have a watch. I'd like to have a watch. I certainly want one that I'll like. But at the moment, I'm not looking for a collection, just a nice, good quality watch that I'll be proud to have around my wrist. I can definitely see the attraction to having multiple watches as I've seen several drastically different styles that I've been very impressed with. But right now, I'm just looking for that first knock-out watch that's going to make me happy all the way around. I really want to find one that I don't have to make any compromises on. It may not fill every need, but I don't want to look at it and think "Gee, I wish this was different" And that includes "Gee, I hope I bought a nice enough watch that I can trust it's quality for a very long time"

What constitutes that "it" watch for me? I don't know. the few things I know for sure are that I want it to be mechanical, and I really want it to be an automatic. Other than that, I just can't say. I've seen some with bezels that I like, but for the most part, I prefer no bezel. I've seen some with white faces I like, but I'm really leaning towards black. I always prefer arabic numbers over romans, but arabic, even numbers at all aren't even a requirement. I don't like busy, but don't like simple either. I like a lot of chronographs. I also like skeletons, but haven't found a skeleton that has really knocked it out for me yet... One of my problems with them is that they tend to be overdone with little curly-q engravings in the movements. I don't mind the decoration, but maybe not quite so much.

After I've found my watch, then all bets are off. If I see one with a few features I like, that can fill a different purpose for $50, I'll be more inclined to pick it up and not worry about what I would change on it.

But with the goofy MSRP's, and the hoards of ebay sellers selling the same watch for anywhere from $50 to $500 it makes researching VERY difficult. As for searching here, I have. I searched for Wohler before I posted this thread. Unless I did something wrong, this is only the 4th thread posted on WUS that mentions Wohlers. I'll keep looking. If nothing else, I do enjoy looking at them all.

wardog · Jan 17, 2010

I know it's frustrating, just take your time. You'll find one that "sings" to you soon.

I think it would help to narrow it down a bit to a style. Pilot, Diver, Dress, etc.. Then, (like you did before) come back here and ask for opinions on your possible choices.

You may want to check out the Orient Mako, Seiko Monster, and various Berhardt models. Go to www.longislandwatch.com You can shop by price. Check out the $150-$200 category.

If you like the Wohler, I'd say get it. I've bought a lot of the "mushroom" watches and have been pleasantly surprised. Just don't overpay. Put a few models you like on your "watched items" list and see what they end up going for (or search listings that have ended). Once you get a feel for the "real" price step in and make your move. I've gotten a number of them for peanuts. I've purchased over 40 watches, most of them on ebay, with the majority of them having chinese movements. I've had problems with 2. One was Swiss, one was Chinese.

Good Luck! :-!

MoonPhase · May 12, 2010

wardog said:
I know it's frustrating, just take your time. You'll find one that "sings" to you soon.

I think it would help to narrow it down a bit to a style. Pilot, Diver, Dress, etc.. Then, (like you did before) come back here and ask for opinions on your possible choices.

You may want to check out the Orient Mako, Seiko Monster, and various Berhardt models. Go to www.longislandwatch.com You can shop by price. Check out the $150-$200 category.

If you like the Wohler, I'd say get it. I've bought a lot of the "mushroom" watches and have been pleasantly surprised. Just don't overpay. Put a few models you like on your "watched items" list and see what they end up going for (or search listings that have ended). Once you get a feel for the "real" price step in and make your move. I've gotten a number of them for peanuts. I've purchased over 40 watches, most of them on ebay, with the majority of them having chinese movements. I've had problems with 2. One was Swiss, one was Chinese.

Good Luck! :-!

Hey !
From the 40 watches you have bought, is there any particular brand that stand out as better movement, case and design ? I am going through a lot of mushroom brands that people have mentioned above and even entry level vintage Russian , Pobeda,Vostok etc.....
So ,for budget below 30 dollar, what is the best watch I can get ? Does the vintage Russian better than those Chinese in the similar price range ?
Many thanks !!

musicus · Apr 1, 2011

mitchelwb said:
So I've looked at a ton of watches in the last couple days... I've found a lot I like, few that I've heard of, still feel like I really don't know much more now than when I started. There seems to be as many manufacturers as there are models and I just don't have any idea what is or isn't a good price on what is or isn't a good watch.

So I'm going to ask about this one. I've search for Wohler here and not found much. What little was there wasn't glowing, and was also quite old.

I'm looking at this one and just curious of other thoughts. Am I barking mad? Is this a good deal? good watch? I just don't know what to look for, and online it's even harder. Toss in ebay, and you never know if you're dealing with someone shady or not. There's just so much schlock on ebay to wade through to find the stuff you really care about.

Appreciate in advance.

I bought a Wohler about 2 years ago, an automatic, and it runs great when you're wearing it. Problem is it's kinda hard to to when you look at the eBay photos that this watch is really a lot thicker than it looks on the photo. For me, that was a big negative. It seems they can't make thin automatics. Perhaps they should make non-automatic quartz watches. If they did, I might buy one. Also I wonder why they don't sell Wohlers in stores, only on ebay.

musicus · May 14, 2011

Wohler watches are mostly automatics, and they are extremely thick. This is not obvious from their ebay photos.

Thoughts on Wohler

mitchelwb

gloster

mitchelwb

AlbertaTime

cptbluebear

gigfy

mitchelwb

gloster

mitchelwb

gloster

sbkurtz

cptbluebear

mitchelwb

wardog

MoonPhase

musicus

musicus

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