The first watch probably has a German case by Rodi & Wienenberger from Pforzheim. I can't find the maker but the movement is a medium class generic calibre by Adolf Schild, something from the Cal. 1012 family:
...which was also made by Durowe later. The second watch probably has a cheapo pin lever (I can see something like a "17" on the dial without the word "jewels" after it while in the bottom half, noncommittal words like "De Luxe", "Jewelled" without a jewel count and "Waterprotected" appear). I'm afraid I can't read the brand name on the dial clearly (OTTMER?!) so I can't identify it further.
Just what I was I looking for, thank you so much Hartmut Richter.
I naively thought that the Ottmer/Gitmer?/Gttmer?? would have a 17 jewel movement, but having just taken the case back off - I see 1 jewel Constructa
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