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Aquatico Dolphin ?

Seems like a lot for the money. Almost too good but micros have been dropping their prices recently in order to compete and have been using either NH35 or 9015 to help keep prices low.
I would guess people think it's a copy of an Anonimo. Very similar styling. I would be tempted if it came in SS.
A little put off but the owner trying to be a "happy customer" here though.
It's actually a stolen design from Borealis Batial with 100pct the same case and buckle. The Batial is an Anonimo homage no doubt.

Aquatico is actually the deep diver factory of Borealis Batial, Seafarer and Bullshark. They changed the bezel, dial and crown. Since they are the factory, they can sell super cheap compared to every other microbrand.

Few will care because Borealis makes so many homages but this is wrong, illegal and messed up.

Aquatico takes Borealis money for tooling and prototypes and produces more than Borealis paid so they can sell it as theirs later. Same thing with Seafarer. Borealis paid for 500 cases but they built 1000 Seafarers instead.

Owner blocked all communication with Borealis and will continue to sell Borealis intellectual property with Borealis tooling.

If you are curious to see what the Aquatico Dolphin case and buckle look like more up close, here you go, 100pct the same:










Pretty sad. The Portugal brands worked with Aquatico for 10years and basically showed them the ropes. He could've done this without stealing. Could've added a millimeter here and taken a millimeter out. But no.

And here's the beginning of the 500 Seafarers they built without asking Borealis blackmailing them into buying more or they'd sell it at theirs:

http://www.aquaticowatch.com/nautilus-p-299.html#.WfFgTEFlDYW

I won't comment again but I feel like you all should know who you send your money to if you do. To a super greedy and ungrateful thief. Aquatico is already being banned from some Facebook groups, well deserved.

EDIT:

This was just published:

https://28da.....lier.com/2017/10/2...es-like-theirs-for-sale-by-a-different-brand/
 

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It's actually a stolen design from Borealis Batial with 100pct the same case and buckle. The Batial is an Anonimo homage no doubt.

Aquatico is actually the deep diver factory of Borealis Batial, Seafarer and Bullshark. They changed the bezel, dial and crown. Since they are the factory, they can sell super cheap compared to every other microbrand.

Few will care because Borealis makes so many homages but this is wrong, illegal and messed up.

Aquatico takes Borealis money for tooling and prototypes and produces more than Borealis paid so they can sell it as theirs later. Same thing with Seafarer. Borealis paid for 500 cases but they built 1000 Seafarers instead.

Owner blocked all communication with Borealis and will continue to sell Borealis intellectual property with Borealis tooling.

If you are curious to see what the Aquatico Dolphin case and buckle look like more up close, here you go, 100pct the same:










Pretty sad. The Portugal brands worked with Aquatico for 10years and basically showed them the ropes. He could've done this without stealing. Could've added a millimeter here and taken a millimeter out. But no.

And here's the beginning of the 500 Seafarers they built without asking Borealis blackmailing them into buying more or they'd sell it at theirs:

http://www.aquaticowatch.com/nautilus-p-299.html#.WfFgTEFlDYW

I won't comment again but I feel like you all should know who you send your money to if you do. To a super greedy and ungrateful thief. Aquatico is already being banned from some Facebook groups, well deserved.

EDIT:

This was just published:

https://28da.....lier.com/2017/10/2...es-like-theirs-for-sale-by-a-different-brand/
Im glad you posted this, as I came to do the same. I just saw Borealis post the article to their Facebook, and I'll be making sure I let anyone I can know not to buy from Aquatico.

I know there are plenty of people who don't agree with homage watches, but flat out stealing tooling and molds a company has paid for is wrong.

Borealis is an essential watch company for someone like me who doesn't have luxury watch money, and would have never owned some of my favorite watches. I'll take a well made homage with some nice design tweaks to make the watch it's own beast instead, and be thrilled with it. It would be a damn shame if their business were hurt by some dink stealing their tooling and molds.

EDIT: I went to the Aquatico facebook page, and the guy who owns the company gave it the first 5 star review from his personal account. That's pretty sketchy if you ask me.

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^^^ so its ok for Borealis to copy EXACTLY COPY Isofrane and put their name on it but Aquatico can't modify the design and put their name on it?
That's not what Aquatico has done. They have used the exact tooling and molds that Borealis had paid the factory to produce specifically for them. On one hand we are talking about a company producing a watch that looks like another watch or strap, etc., which I can see people having issue with. On the other hand you have a company stealing the actual tooling and molds another company has designed and paid for, and using them to produce their own watches with the exact same case. It's two very different scenarios.

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I’m not saying what has been done is morally right but this type of thing is rife in China. Don’t hate me for saying this but I actually much prefer this design to that of Borealis, they have turn what was to my eyes an ugly duck into a beautiful swan.
 

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I'll leave this here,





I see this all the time, re branding (stealing designs) who knows, literally all products we use have this, its not actually manufactured by the brand, they just buy the design from a factory like those catalog watch cases.
 

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Re: Aquatico Dolphin 🐬

Does this case use a new ferrous bronze? I ask because I see the Irony...
 
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Personally it's the overall appearance that's important, in my opinion this Aquatico and the Borealis look completely different... almost to the point that you'd think they weren't the same basic design. I fully get why Carlos feels so pissed but this isn't a carbon copy of he's design, new bezel, new dial, new hands, new crown and new movement surely makes this a completely different watch.

The real concern is if you would have a warranty, don't exactly know how good Chinese companies are in this respect.


P.S.
Who actually owns the rights to the molds?

If Carlos says he does and has proof of this then I'm in complete agreement with him but if not then maybe in the future every Micro should look into this to safeguard your manufacturer undercutting you.
 

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you are new and timely to the discussion, and your hand profile is not an extension of Calvin Lee adding credibility to this initial offering
 

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What IP agreements are in place here - specifically for the molds paid for by Borealis? If that part is sufficiently covered then legal recourse is surely an option. If not, then a lot of things we see in micro world always seem to fall into a huge grey zone (including many of Borealis' own homages - some of watches still in production).
 

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Another fascinating spirited debate. There are enough wrists for everyone (14 Billion and counting) and this is difficult to judge from the outside by reading a thread. Certainly nothing wrong with homages or attempt to create a better version of an older watch design. Borealis as an expert at that and that is why they offer so much value for their watches. Imagine if Borealis had to outsource to watch designers in Swiss or Italy to come up with a total new design a la Genta? Their prices would then be too high for the affordable category. Whether Calvin Lee did something illegal or not, let the courts or market figure that out and allow divine justice to play it's hand (unless Borealis has such a compelling case and sues them). Perhaps what Aquatico did is wrong or perhaps the contract stipulated that they are allowed to fabricate anything in their factory or use the extra cases/design with the tools. It's a badge of honor for Anonimo, Omega, etc... etc...that Borealis emulated some of their models and it should be a badge of honor for Borealis, that Aquatico copied his. Recently, exact copies to Seiko such as Sharkey or some to the Halios Puck started to surface wand many other Seiko MM300 have homages. Even, the well regarded MWW created the 62MAs through a well earned fan base clamoring for it. Any Asia/Portugal Cross Border Intellectual Property Attorney feel free to chime in. It's part of the business and keeps pricing/quality honest. Borealis has nothing to worry about given that their prices are so good to begin with. Just celebrate the global abundance for both designer homage creator as Borealis, Sharkey, Crepas, etc...
AS to the tools, if they bought the tools for Borealis, I wonder if they could have taken delivery of such tools to prevent this, or the factory of Aquatico owned the tools?
That's not what Aquatico has done. They have used the exact tooling and molds that Borealis had paid the factory to produce specifically for them. On one hand we are talking about a company producing a watch that looks like another watch or strap, etc., which I can see people having issue with. On the other hand you have a company stealing the actual tooling and molds another company has designed and paid for, and using them to produce their own watches with the exact same case. It's two very different scenarios.

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^Think about it, you are paying a someone to copy (with subtle changes) a design you don't own for your financial gain which to many is a little shady and are then surprised when the people you got into bed with do the dirt?

If you look at the Chinese car market at the number of copies of luxury European brands is anyone truly surprised this has happened.
 

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Technically, Borealis did not produce this copy by stealing omega tooling and mold. So I don't see a problem here! Lol.

Or did they?

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No but this whole business of homage is a little shady don't you think. Some feel it's ok whilst others are dead against it.
 

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No but this whole business of homage is a little shady don't you think. Some feel it's ok whilst others are dead against it.
Sorry I was being sarcastic lol. I know what you mean though. This topic has been beaten to death for million times. I came to conclusion that as long as the Chinese is involved, it is not okay lol.

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Borealis cooperated with a Chinese factory in order to produce a copy of a successful, pre-existing design and make profit out of it. And so they did.
Unfortunately this factory did virtually the same to them. Different way same outcome. And now they feel insulted? Kind of ironic isn’t it?
I don’t know if the incident involves any actual physical theft like tools etc. But theft is theft anyway. Whether it’s a tool or a design or whatever.

For those who don’t know Tactico from Spain fell in the same trap more than a year ago. They ordered 300 cases for the L.E. Anko and they received 400. They copied a successful Seiko design as well.

I have been an owner of both the Estoril and the Anko so I should be the last one to talk about homages. But I cannot overlook that it’s not the right way. This business needs more fantasy and innovative design
 

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Borealis cooperated with a Chinese factory in order to produce a copy of a successful, pre-existing design and make profit out of it. And so they did.
Unfortunately this factory did virtually the same to them. Different way same outcome. And now they feel insulted? Kind of ironic isn't it?
I don't know if the incident involves any actual physical theft like tools etc. But theft is theft anyway. Whether it's a tool or a design or whatever.

For those who don't know Tactico from Spain fell in the same trap more than a year ago. They ordered 300 cases for the L.E. Anko and they received 400. They copied a successful Seiko design as well.

I have been an owner of both the Estoril and the Anko so I should be the last one to talk about homages. But I cannot overlook that it's not the right way. This business needs more fantasy and innovative design
The problem is watches have been around for a very long time and it's extremely difficult to come up with something completely original, some elements but not an entirely new design.

Which brings me back to the two watches in question, in my opinion the Aquatico is sufficiently different in appearance and the movement at its heart to not be classed as a copy.

It's like taking a Golf R and turning it into a TRSS, basic structure is the same but different enough to not be classed a copy.
 
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