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Discussion Starter #1
Hello, this is my first post in WUS, so greetings to all of you!!

Well, before i start with my concern, I just want to make clear that i'm not a professional watchmaker:-s, but im learning and is pretty fun for me, but theres moment like this one that kills me, and those are the problems with the balance wheel.

Im working with a Caliber 1012 Auto Date, from a cosmic 2000, basically the balance wheel turns for a few seconds and than stop. So here's my few diagnostics i already did.

- Balance Jewel top= Removed, jewel was stock to the cap, clean it and oil it.
- Balance Jewel bottom= removed, and also stock, clean it and oil it.
- Balance Pivots= To my eyes looks fine, but i will post some pics of the bottom pivot, i will try to get to pivot pic to post and see if you guys can see anything out of normal, dont know what else to look since im short in troubleshooting experience.:-s

Mean while the whole movement is in working condition, no damage gear or anything else that will make the balance wheel stop running.




heres a picture of the balance harispring
 

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There are many reasons why this could be happening, but probably the first I would start with is that the gear train is delivering power from the mainspring inefficiently. The basic thing you need to do before spending too much more time on diagnosing the problem is to fully disassemble the movement, give everything a good cleaning (best if you have a machine or ultrasonic), reassemble, lubricate and test. You should obviously inspect all parts while reassembling for any defects.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thx, Joe, Everything is in working order, Clean with ultrasonic solution, oil jewels of train wheels, before i install the pallet bridge, i make sure all the train wheels are moving properly and smooth, when I remove main spring steel in pretty good shape (I will put a new one once i find the problem with the balance) but i clean and re-oil the main spring and has a good strength.I dont think is the hair spring, i move with the tweezzers the balance wheel to see if theres that extra loose movement and feels ok, to me, i untied the balance bridge screw to see if the balance bridge was making any preasure on the pivots but nothing, another thing, when it moves runs in will run in the up position but if i move it to the vertical position it will stop. the will looks to me in balance. I you want me to post a video in HD let me know i will do.

Thx a lot for your time
 

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The fact that it runs in the dial up position and then stops when moved to another position might indicate a problem with the balance pivot or jewels. Inspect the jewels closely to make sure they are true and not are not cracked. Assuming this is o.k. (which is usually the case), your problem might be in the pivot. Sometimes the balance pivot is worn in a way that cannot be identified by simply checking for end-shake, etc. If this is the case you would need to have the balance repivoted or get a new balance complete. In any case, not an easy or cheap solution. My 2c.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The fact that it runs in the dial up position and then stops when moved to another position might indicate a problem with the balance pivot or jewels. Inspect the jewels closely to make sure they are true and not are not cracked. Assuming this is o.k. (which is usually the case), your problem might be in the pivot. Sometimes the balance pivot is worn in a way that cannot be identified by simply checking for end-shake, etc. If this is the case you would need to have the balance repivoted or get a new balance complete. In any case, not an easy or cheap solution. My 2c.
I bought from J&B the lower jewel with cap so i will wait to arrive to put it back, i have a good feeling that is the pivots, as you can see in the picture looks kind of bend? dont know too much since i never seeing one, i got a unimat lathe but i dont know how to use it yet, because i can make the pivot but not in that level yet :-s
 

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As Joe pointed out, balance staffs are extremely delicate, even with the anti-shock jewels they can bend or simply wear due to lack of maintenance. Also, make sure the hair-spring is seated properly in the curb pin/post slot and although I'm not sure off the top of my head as regards that particular movement, some curb pins/posts have more than one slot, try both. When you assemble the balance cock onto the plate, make sure there is no dirt, marks, burrs, rough hole edges, etc. that could cause it to seat incorrectly...
 

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If the balance pivot looks bent then that is the problem (at least one of them). Trying to replace a pivot by yourself without training will not get you very far. It is not a simple task. I would suggest getting a book to see what is involved (like practical watch repairing by De Carle). If after seeing what is involved you think you want to try it, then go for it.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Ok, i will try, i like to try new thing or i never learn :), i pay for a online basic course from a guy named "tascione" and he has a video that exactly explain the same situation, but i haven't got my staking tool set yet and to do that i need that, if i want to buy the whole balance with the HS it will cost me 275.00 what i will do is to take it to a local watchmaker to see if he can fix it, because that part is beyond of what I'm capable of doing right now because i don't have the staking tools and i don't know how to use my minni lathe to create a new pivot, unless i can get the pivot already made for that caliber.

Either way, thx guy, to me is a bend pivot, also that pivot looks that already have some wear on it.

Joe thx a lot for your guide i got other technical question to ask, I got the practical repair book, is a really good book, but I'm missing some tools to create. Also thx Keiron i will take this advises to appply in my next problematic movement, since Im working on old watches this will be something i need to master because is something common that balance pivot have this type of problem with time
 
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