WatchUSeek Watch Forums banner
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello and welcome to the 22nd instalment of Bring a Brain! This one will be shorter than BaB usually is, but then again, it isn't the purpose of this watchdog/comedy series to consist of long episodes, but ones that will serve as a source of knowledge and laughs. Lads and lasses, this is your Bring a Brain!

First, a certain advertorial site's Shop, and their listings.

https://shop.hodinkee.com/collectio...atic-in-stainless-steel?variant=2161696964623
This Omega Geneve has escaped my attention the first time, but it does deserve a good look - mostly because the movement is just one big "nope."
First of all, the ref. 14703 has been introduced in the 1950s, in 1959 to be precise, but the serial of this one points to 1960-1961.
The rotor is heavily worn, and the tone of the plating on it is quite noticeably different than the one found on the rest of the movement. The wear to it is quite extensive. The case back appears to have traces of rubbing. Which means that a)it's not the first rotor that it has, and b)this one also was or still is rubbing against the case back.
"Caliber: automatic caliber movement." No, seriously, it's right in front of their eyes. It's an elephant in the room, and it sits right on the train bridge, and they just happen not to notice it, going with the usual annotation for movements that they were not capable of identifying. By Jove, who was in charge of authenticating this watch?

1930s Universal Geneve chrono:
https://shop.hodinkee.com/collectio...sal-geneve-early-compur?variant=5403135049743
First of all, it's not signed "Compur" anywhere... Ahhh, the struggle for giving nicknames and model names that a watch never had. What it does have, is extensive wear to the movement. Not like it's all caked in filth and old grease like the movements in most of the watches they sell, but obviously, whoever owned it in the past, skipped service more than once, and didn't really take good care of the watch. "Light wear to the case", as they put it, appears to be some rather heavy pitting in the steel, and Breguet numerals - unlike the numerals on this watch - happen to be italicized.

UG Monodate:
https://shop.hodinkee.com/collectio...iversal-geneve-monodate?variant=5403138424847
"The movement is in running condition, and the date function is advancing correctly at this time." Sounds almost as if it was to break down the moment it reaches a new buyer. That said, obviously unserviced (well, that's the most unfortunate standard there, no?), and while the movement's not all greasy and filthy, it will require a service.


Now, lads and lasses, it's time for YouTubers who pretend to know anything (with a rather poor result), and their shop! Lads and lasses, T&H!

Just look at this:
https://theoandharris.com/vintage-watch-shop/vintage-watches/yema/

Dirt-common 1980s quartz, and...$885? It's the 7th of February, not the 1st of April! You've got to be bloody kidding me!

Now, this Omega:
https://theoandharris.com/vintage-watch-shop/vintage-watches-sold/omega-calendar/
The dial is in poor condition, and the date disk looks repainted. I mean, the dial's all worn, and then there's the wonky 8 on the date wheel, the background of which is as white as The Grand Tour's Richard Hammond's teeth.
Most Omega Calendars from the early 1950s were signed "Swiss Made", not "Swiss", and most of them belonged to the Seamaster collection - this one is marked neither Seamaster nor Calendar, which is rather odd. Not that these things necessarily indicate a redial, as the printing, font and minute track alignment appear to be OK.


Let's move to another shop - previously, BaB has covered their fondness of the Cape Cod cloth and the dremel. Today...Yes, we're gonna look at some more cases of capecodclothicide.

https://vintagecaliber.com/products/1955-patek-philippe-ref-2458-pink-on-pink
"Mint condition, professionally and lightly polished." No!!! Either it's mint, or it's polished. Can't be both. Just like something can't be clean and dirty at the same time. "Up for sale, this very clean Land Rover Defender, which just drove through a swamp and a muddy pasture full of sheep droppings." Yes, that adds up the same way as their assessment of the condition of the case.
"Precise chronometer-grade manual-winding movement with sweep seconds." Where do you see a sweep second on this watch? By Jove...

https://vintagecaliber.com/collecti...-jaeger-lecoultre-jumbo-memovox-date-ref-e855
"Professionally polished to factory specs, showing no traces of use." That's the nth time they use that lengthy oxymoron. Most listings have that - it's like Groundhog Day, same scenario (capecodclothicide) over and over again.

https://vintagecaliber.com/collections/all/products/1950-iwc-schaffhausen-cal-89-jumbo-claw-lugs
Same case condition assessment. Episode VII: The Dremel Awakens

https://vintagecaliber.com/collections/all/products/1947-jaeger-lecoultre-cal-450-dresswatch
Episode VIII: The Last Cape Cod.

That's all for this instalment of Bring a Brain! Hope those who sought entertainment, were entertained, and those who sought knowledge, were illuminated. Until next time! Bring a Brain will return if necessary!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I love that T&H adds the useless "What you'll find when you rip apart that UPS box on your doorstep" photo but can't be bothered to include photos of the movement and inside of the caseback.

No matter, apparently it serves their target customers well.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Yeah... Moronic listings for the moron buyers. I mean, even the Advertorial Site tends to provide more info than them. Often incorrect and thus useless info, or impossible to verify due to the lack of movement pictures, which makes it useless all the same, but they at least pretend to provide the buyer with something. T&H doesn't do even that. When it comes to identifying movements, H might have rather poor skills, but T&H have none.
 
  • Like
Reactions: georges zaslavsky

·
Registered
Joined
·
696 Posts
Yeah... Moronic listings for the moron buyers. I mean, even the Advertorial Site tends to provide more info than them. Often incorrect and thus useless info, or impossible to verify due to the lack of movement pictures, which makes it useless all the same, but they at least pretend to provide the buyer with something. T&H doesn't do even that. When it comes to identifying movements, H might have rather poor skills, but T&H have none.
Well said, although I prefer to use the term "uninformed" buyer.

Just a few short years ago I was one of these uninformed buyers myself. Fortunately, my pockets aren't deep enough (and I have too much common sense) to shell out $5K. My rookie mistake was spending $500 on a re-dialed cal 281 Longines. Embarrassing.... but never again.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Well said, although I prefer to use the term "uninformed" buyer.

Just a few short years ago I was one of these uninformed buyers myself. Fortunately, my pockets aren't deep enough (and I have too much common sense) to shell out $5K. My rookie mistake was spending $500 on a re-dialed cal 281 Longines. Embarrassing.... but never again.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
"Uninformed" fits even better, though I've used "moron", as most of their customers are believers in Christian the Guru, who in fact is anything but a guru. Almost every weekly lot of the watches they sell gets coverage on their channel. When I heard that guy doing all the panegyrical claptrap about a redialed Rolex and a redialed Omega, both so obviously repainted that it hurts the eyes just to look at them, I wondered just how on Earth can anyone still take him seriously. I mean, it takes a serious lack of powers of observation to mistake him for as much as a rookie, as he's below rookie level. Just a clueless watch peddler and copywriter pretending to be an expert. The fancy veneer for the snobs, with bottles of wine and whisky in the background, or sipping whisky... Faux-connoisseurs. That's too much, even for me. Good whisky isn't bad, but posing with bottles and pretending to be a posh boy is annoying. "Look what Mummy's trust fund bought! A bottle of 18 years old single malt!" It's so good that his kind isn't drinking where I'm drinking.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
696 Posts
"Uninformed" fits even better, though I've used "moron", as most of their customers are believers in Christian the Guru, who in fact is anything but a guru. Almost every weekly lot of the watches they sell gets coverage on their channel. When I heard that guy doing all the panegyrical claptrap about a redialed Rolex and a redialed Omega, both so obviously repainted that it hurts the eyes just to look at them, I wondered just how on Earth can anyone still take him seriously. I mean, it takes a serious lack of powers of observation to mistake him for as much as a rookie, as he's below rookie level. Just a clueless watch peddler and copywriter pretending to be an expert. The fancy veneer for the snobs, with bottles of wine and whisky in the background, or sipping whisky... Faux-connoisseurs. That's too much, even for me. Good whisky isn't bad, but posing with bottles and pretending to be a posh boy is annoying. "Look what Mummy's trust fund bought! A bottle of 18 years old single malt!" It's so good that his kind isn't drinking where I'm drinking.
You get up quite early, mkws (or perhaps you're an insomniac)!! I love that you always have gas in the rant tank, so to speak.

I haven't seen the video(s) you speak of, although based on your description I suppose I'm quite fortunate. Anyway, I am well familiar with the type of pretentious faux-expert you describe.

And with that, I'll be throwing back my first sip of a humble 10 year Laphroaig. ☺

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,716 Posts
MKWS- Thanks for the rant!
It was thoroughly enjoyable.

I never took a close look at cases I knew were polished, and I think I see some differences, mostly in the warped reflections they give.

Oh yeah- I used to watch T&H - for about a week - and had happily forgotten the bad taste that caused me to delete their channel & website.

Glad you're having fun! I enjoyed it too!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
You get up quite early, mkws (or perhaps you're an insomniac)!!
A fairly mild form of insomnia, actually.

I love that you always have gas in the rant tank, so to speak.
Well, they just won't stop providing me with topics for these, and sometimes these topics are so good, that it would truly be a shame not to deliver a rant.

I haven't seen the video(s) you speak of, although based on your description I suppose I'm quite fortunate. Anyway, I am well familiar with the type of pretentious faux-expert you describe.
Yes, you are fortunate. I can only watch a T&H video, when I'm in a mood so good, that not even their claptrap could ruin it. Which, given that I've been under a lot of stress (due to being buried under a ton of things to do at work) recently, happens rarely. Besides, I'll soon be making a watch purchase I've been after for a long time, and I wouldn't want to spend that on a new computer - which would be the case if I'd watch some more T&H videos, as they make me want to smash the screen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
89 Posts
1930s Universal Geneve chrono:
https://shop.hodinkee.com/collectio...sal-geneve-early-compur?variant=5403135049743
First of all, it's not signed "Compur" anywhere... Ahhh, the struggle for giving nicknames and model names that a watch never had. What it does have, is extensive wear to the movement. Not like it's all caked in filth and old grease like the movements in most of the watches they sell, but obviously, whoever owned it in the past, skipped service more than once, and didn't really take good care of the watch. "Light wear to the case", as they put it, appears to be some rather heavy pitting in the steel, and Breguet numerals - unlike the numerals on this watch - happen to be italicized.
In their listing, they stated double column wheel but I only see one column wheel in the movement photo. Can anyone point the second one out to me?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,590 Posts
And sadly the history repeats itself with Hoddinkee, Theo and Harris and Crown and Caliber who are the biggest dolts when it comes to sell watches. As usual beyond poor condition watches and the pity is that there are still stupid buyers buying from these dolts.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,590 Posts
I love that T&H adds the useless "What you'll find when you rip apart that UPS box on your doorstep" photo but can't be bothered to include photos of the movement and inside of the caseback.

No matter, apparently it serves their target customers well.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
The Theo and Harris buyers are of the same level than the Hoodwinkee buyers which means not enough demanding and not enough torough to check that what they buy wouldn't pass a standard inspection among a normal collector.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
13,590 Posts
In their listing, they stated double column wheel but I only see one column wheel in the movement photo. Can anyone point the second one out to me?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It doesn't exist, it is only in their imagination that the second column wheel exists.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
It doesn't exist, it is only in their imagination that the second column wheel exists.
Actually, it might exist - the movements in early Compurs indeed had a second column wheel, located on the dial side. Without a picture of the dial side of this one, however, there's no telling if it's one of these (well, it's not a Compur, so...), and so, if the movement in it indeed has the second column wheel or not.
 

·
Zenith Forum Co-moderator
Joined
·
19,442 Posts
I would have thought that a second column wheel would only make sense on a split seconds (rattrapante) chronograph.....

Hartmut Richter
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I would have thought that a second column wheel would only make sense on a split seconds (rattrapante) chronograph.....

Hartmut Richter
It was a slightly nonsensical (in terms of how was it executed, rather than of its purpose) modification to the basic monopusher movement, to allow a pause in the timing, and then a restart without resetting to zero.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,787 Posts
Actually, it might exist - the movements in early Compurs indeed had a second column wheel, located on the dial side. Without a picture of the dial side of this one, however, there's no telling if it's one of these (well, it's not a Compur, so...), and so, if the movement in it indeed has the second column wheel or not.
Interesting, do you know the calibers of these movements? They could be interesting to collect.

I have generally seen cal 281/285/287 movements inside Compur chronographs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,860 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Interesting, do you know the calibers of these movements? They could be interesting to collect.

I have generally seen cal 281/285/287 movements inside Compur chronographs.
No idea about their calibre number. It's not the 281, as the size is different (this measures 14.5''', the 281 - 12'''). More likely a predecessor of the 281. Still, with that solution, this movement would have been yesterday's news by 1934, to which year the Hoodwinkee specimen dates, as by then, the two-pusher cal. 281 was already in production for two long years.
Could be a two-pusher conversion of some monopusher movements that they had in storage, and which they wanted to get rid of. Not something "early" or revolutionary.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,784 Posts
I love that you always have gas in the rant tank, so to speak.
You just made my day! What a wonderful phrasing!
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Top