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Discussion Starter #1
Well I spotted this fellah on the bay and fell for the case immediately. It's evocative of the Panerai Radiomir in shape and not a mark on it that I could see. Browsing via a smart phone didn't give much detail but I pushed the button anyway as it was bottom dollar-no bids and it would at least team up well with particular black shirt I have!

Rodania1.JPG

Rodania2.JPG

Rodania3.JPG

hmmm...what's going on with the Roley style caseback? would that be an original Rodania fitting? Haven't found anything like it via Google image search...

Rodania4.JPG

Crown not signed?

Rodania5.JPG

Rodania6.JPG

It arrived this morning and the first job was to remove the back and have a 'butcher's hook' at the movement. First surprise was that it was a snap on not a screw on case back.

Rodania7.JPG

Ohhhhh-K! Never mind let's press on. The movement ring is a crude looking affair that looks like it was whittled from old Tupperware with a blunt Stanley knife by someone suffering with what must be quite a debilitating 'intention tremor'! Loosely attached to it was a curl of swarf. Good job I found that before it had a chance to cause further damage. Allarm bells ringing loudly now...

Rodania8.JPG

Rodania9.JPG

A few movement pics...

Rodania10.JPG

Rodania11.JPG

Rodania12.JPG

Rodania13.JPG

It runs sweetly and strongly enough and sets fine (no hacking) although the winding stem is rather stiff in one part of its rotation. Pretty sure Rodania would have done a better job of the pearlage/scalloping on the plates etc. I'm calling this out as a fake but before I get back to the seller I would much appreciate the input of any Rodania savants regarding its veracity. (don't want to kick off without good reason) In its favour; it does look good with the shirt though!
 

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When they redialed it and put a movement in a new case they chose to make it a Rodania -- strange. They could have sold it for more if they had make it into an Omega. I guess they knew that would have been too much to believe. I would have turned it into an IWC at least! LOL
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Well that's what I initially thought, nobody would bother faking something like a Rodania. Right then time to pass on the bad news. Might put a post up on the Chinese Mechanicals section to try and find out what movement it actually is. Thanks Eeeb.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
The movement looks to be an FHF-ST cal. 96. They came in this fish-scale type finish.
Wow, you know your onions Gumby, thanks for that and on the strength of that I've just found this...

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCwQFjAC&url=http://www.christophlorenz.de/watch/movements/f/fhf/fhf_st_96.php?l=en&ei=GzbiU4ewPIiy0QXjyoCIAQ&usg=AFQjCNGOfwsld6WXSQr3f82gAtCOpkKjJQ&bvm=bv.72197243,d.d2k

FHF_ST_96.jpg

Are we saying here that this watch (or rather the movement at least) could be genuine? I've just spotted more loose swarf and bits of 'plating flash' rolling around the dial. I can't believe Rodania would let that dial out of their factory.
 

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Are we saying here that this watch could be genuine? i've just spotted more loose swarf and bits of 'plating flash' rolling around the dial. I can't believe Rodania would let that dial out of their factory.
I don't know that the movement being an FHF-ST 96 really means too much with regard to the watch being genuine Rodania or something put together. These were long-produced and inexpensive Swiss movements and found their way into many, many less expensive watches. The movement example in your watch uses a non-Incabloc shock protection setting - again, I don't know what various settings were used in these movements over the years.

The movement looks like it may have a import code on it... "?XT", (can't make out the first letter in the photo). That may give some clue, at least to who imported the movement. (Rodiania is "ROT").

Rodania were a decent brand in the past, in the 1950/60s, but I really have no idea what they got up to later. If that dial is original the quality of printing is not very crisp.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I don't know that the movement being an FHF-ST 96 really means too much with regard to the watch being genuine Rodania or something put together. These were long-produced and inexpensive Swiss movements and found their way into many, many less expensive watches.
So I've noticed, some good names among them.


The movement example in your watch uses a non-Incabloc shock protection setting - again, I don't know what various settings were used in these movements over the years.
Quite so, the pics and illustrations I've found so far show all variants recognisably had Incabloc protection. This one has some kind of 3 pronged circlip affair holding the jewel. I have seen this system before which involves rotating the clip 1/8 of a turn to release it but can't for the life of me remember which watch was the subject of the video stripdown on youtube.

The movement looks like it may have a import code on it... "?XT", (can't make out the first letter in the photo). That may give some clue, at least to who imported the movement. (Rodiania is "ROT").
Until I can track down my X10 loupe the best I can make out from using a hand magnifier is "uXT"

Rodania were a decent brand in the past, in the 1950/60s, but I really have no idea what they got up to later. If that dial is original the quality of printing is not very crisp.
Rodania rang quality bells in my memory which is what attracted me to it. The seller believed it to be NOS but I doubt they had the back off, (it would have been impossible to miss that arc of swarf) so would have been going on the condition of the case alone. Running through the seller's past sales shows that they offload quite a few low to mid value watches so I would have thought they'd have picked this one up as a potential Franken-fake. (Still no reply as yet)
 

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Well dial is surely a fake (re-worked)
 

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Until I can track down my X10 loupe the best I can make out from using a hand magnifier is "uXT"[/QUOTE said:
OK, thanks. I'm not aware of a "UTX" import code, and the format "uTX" with the small u doesn't seem to be an import code anyway. May not be of any help.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Just see it as a working spare movement that can be used to fix up a nice watch in the future..
It's an ill wind that blows no good! I've been looking for a respectable cheap mechanical movement for my project watch to replace the tiny rock bottom quartz Epson AL55 thing that currently struggles to shove the hands round. Can't find a single mark on the movement or a single graunched screw head.

https://www.watchuseek.com/f77/fear-not-lathe-lets-make-some-swarf-guys-1037016.html

I shelled out £15 for the watch plus half that again for postage so if that movement is pukka then I won't feel too aggrieved, and it does look good with the shirt! I really need to give this a good going over though to extract every last flake of swarf of which there seems to be quite a lot.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Can it be IXN, Ardath Watch Co? They used FHF movements. There is a dot after then "n" so I think you should read it upside down so to speak.
Nope, definitely not "IXT". Without the loupe it's difficult to discern through the perlage. Through two magnifiers there is the possibility that it actually says "DXT" if that is any more revealing? Fascinating stuff though Shum and can I ask, where might one find these import references?
 

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Its not an import code. Import codes had to be on the balance cock. That was a legal requirement. And they stopped being used after 1968; this movement has a 70's or later look to it.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
Kept my eyes peeled and guess what?... Here's the same thing, note for note, badged as a Fortis!

super vintage gents retro fortis 17 jewels hand wind watch | eBay

fake Fortis 1.JPG

fake Fortis 2.JPG

Can't contact the seller via Ebay for a movement shot which would be interesting. I wonder what's in the engine room of this one? There is an email though so I shall drop him a line with a heads up that I've reported his sale as an outright fake.
 

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To call something a fake you need to be sure of your grounds. With these watches I wouldn't be sure. The dial printing is poor, but that in itself doesn't necessarily indicate a fake. It's not unheard of to find exactly the same style of watch carrying different brand names. I have a Hamilton automatic watch from the 1990s and have seen the exact same watch carrying another label, (think it was Bulova from memory). Particularly in the 1970s to 1980s/90s when mechanical watches were undergoing a slump many things were done, and shortcuts taken, in the pursuit of economy.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
I simply cannot believe Fortis were ever that financially pressed that they would have to resort to allowing their brand name to be attached to something this shoddy. Subject to definitive correction I'm happy to stick with my diagnosis of fakery regarding these two examples. Even the straps are identical!

The only Fortis I've spotted so far that comes remotely close is the Trueline...
https://www.watchuseek.com/f251/fortis-trueline-149202.html
 

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Since I can't find any link between Rodania and Fortis, we seem to have various options:

1. one or both watches are fakes/Frankenwatches and the name on the dial is a recent addition or edit

2. the watch was made by a third party as a private label product and the two companies both bought specimens and had their names put on them

3. the two companies (both of whom assembled watches from parts anyway since they weren't manufactures) both ordered the same parts from the various suppliers and used them to make their watches

4. the two companies cooperated on this

My personal feeling favours 2. or 4.

Hartmut Richter
 
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