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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am new to the Forum, I have always had a passion for watches and now I am trying to create my own watch brand. I take inspiration from the Atlantic Worldmaster brand. I have always love the ETA movements due to their reliability. My watch brand will be called Carpathia and I am now in the beginning stages of design. I am an excellent Illustrator and Designer so I am sketching out the designs etc. I will later be looking for manufacturers that do custom work to create all necessary components such as dial with raised logo , custom case and engraved caseback with see throuh caseback such as tissot visodate, custom hands, custom crown . I will be creating my watch around the ETA 2836-2 automatic day date movement. I have done a lot of browsing and have found a lot of helpful threads on micro brands.
I would appreciate any additional information anyone has. Currently I have designed my logo and I am now beginning a design for my dial. Along with that I will work on a story for my brand. There is meaning behind my name which relates to the Carpathian Mountains in Europe also know as the Tatry in Poland which is where my family is from.

Here are my beginning stages of development.

first sketches
Text Font Illustration Art Drawing
View attachment carpathia type.jpg View attachment carpathia type_2.pdf Logo Text Font Sky Graphics
Final logo design

Dial Rough
Clock Font Wall clock Analog watch Circle
 

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Very nice graphics ( well educated and trained) skills - Only thing I would try to make sure is that those fine tips on the hands are manufacturable and the fine lines on your logo could be done with a tampo print system, without loosing their filigrane look due to the applicable minimum of color on the rubber! - You certainly can do a 0.2mm line but a 0.0mm sharp tip?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks ! I am going for a simple art deco style watch. Once i sketch up the case I will post pictures, as for the watch straps I make my own so it will most likely be a nice vintage leather style but of coarse that will be up to the customer. =)
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Very nice graphics ( well educated and trained) skills - Only thing I would try to make sure is that those fine tips on the hands are manufacturable and the fine lines on your logo could be done with a tampo print system, without loosing their filigrane look due to the applicable minimum of color on the rubber! - You certainly can do a 0.2mm line but a 0.0mm sharp tip?
Thank you very much ! As far as the hands go I do want them to be fine tips I may alter them still. I am not very familiar with the tampo print system but I will read up on it. Yes I deffinately would like to retain the curvature and accents on the typeface. Ya I suppose I would just need a manufacturer to see how thin they can get the hands. As of right now I do not have any sourced.

I appreciate your help and suggestion, I am very excited and determined to create a very clean and well manufactured watch with a timeless design. =)
 

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Pardon my question - you're graphics designer and or illustrator - are you? Just spoken curiously;)! Your sketch / overlay style shows the pro... ! :) Love that style, but would avoid to buy that horrible expensive pens! - and have far too little practice as experience.... unfortunately
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Pardon my question - you're graphics designer and or illustrator - are you? Just spoken curiously;)! Your sketch / overlay style shows the pro... ! :) Love that style, but would avoid to buy that horrible expensive pens! - and have far too little practice as experience.... unfortunately
Yes I am a Graphic Designer. I do not really have expensive pens per sey, just an expensive tablet called an Intuos pro which allows me to create my Illustrations into vector art/Digital. I finished my Bachelors in Visual Design Studies at Columbia College Chicago in 2012.
|>
 

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Nice - I just own a Bamboo tablet + Corel Paint. But have the problem that I can't watch the screen and coordinate my hands on the desk with the sketch on screen but like to draw directly on paper -what means that I don't use it that much - what finally goes contra improvement ... I do more in direction of practical shaping and CAD works ... The pens I assumed you use would cost 200$ for 32 pcs ... ( similar to COPIC markers)

thats mine - but just hobbyist level!
https://www.watchuseek.com/f77/while-waiting-my-inverter-2733322.html
 

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You might want to mockup this watch yourself as it is no great effort ( 1..2 hours for raw visual modelling) and you would be able to independently do changes and itherations

What I feel is that you use a very narrow strap in relation to the large case diameter - and have rather long lugs.... and brand "C" logo on the bottom ring appears someway .... without orientation to me ... perhaps you could try to get the whole brand name on the ring to make sure that it is not understood as an abstract fish symbol for water tightness.

hj
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
You might want to mockup this watch yourself as it is no great effort ( 1..2 hours for raw visual modelling) and you would be able to independently do changes and itherations

What I feel is that you use a very narrow strap in relation to the large case diameter - and have rather long lugs.... and brand "C" logo on the bottom ring appears someway .... without orientation to me ... perhaps you could try to get the whole brand name on the ring to make sure that it is not understood as an abstract fish symbol for water tightness.

hj
What program are you referring to do a mockup in ? As far as the straps I would use a 19 to 20mm. The C logo was just a trial and error, I think sticking with the whole logo on the caseback and crown would be ideal. As far as the back the center is glass and the shape your looking at is the mechanical winding mechanism. Do you have any links or sources I can utilize that have quality work as far as production of parts?
 

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difficult - especially in the US - you should ask this questions in watchmaker forum ..... in Germany there are 3 manufacturer I know, they don't prototype - but if you would pay a 5 digits price for a number of 50 pcs minimum as small series production just for the metal parts! + small parts + movement + 2 Saphire glasses + strap + dial + hands without assembly.

This is one of the reasons I did not try myself with a micro brand - I do not see the market for a watch for which I - in case of the small production amount I would have to pay twice the money for the parts than a large manufacturer - and to offer unique options I think I would have to have a VERY special design .. special complications special material or something else what differeniates my watch from the 100000 others which are already established on the market in a way which is so clear that it will be bought!!


I use Rhino 3D wich is someway a hybrid in between a Tech CAD and a design cad - Means you can generate technical dimensions and drawings with and you can do technical illustrations - you can buy plugins for photorealistic rendering and 3rd party products for CAM for manufacturing.... At the beginning its a bit hard to get used to it but you rather fast find into this GUI which is pretty good, compared with more expensive programs ... Mc Neel offers a 25 saves free trial so you can try yourself ... If you would be interested I wrote a tutorial to dig into that
- not really watch related but who cares....
 

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I spent about an hour in a quick and dirty mockup done in Rhino5 - I have the assumption that you if you want to stay close to your sketches might get into issues due to little knowledge of the program - I for myself had to find several detail solutions which keep the mockup close to the original look and to stay producable - ( and it is far from beeing cost and wear optimized ) so you would have a lot to do to get from the sketches to a produceable model ... My mockup data is not for share but just to show you what to get out of this process... Time I needed was 1:15 h until this state ... time I estimated to need was 45min . For a beginner probably several days of trial and error... without implementing the necessary functional dimensions and tolerances. Your strap (22mm) appears still too narrow for that case size ( much too large)

Drum Musical instrument Marching percussion Membranophone Snare drum
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I spent about an hour in a quick and dirty mockup done in Rhino5 - I have the assumption that you if you want to stay close to your sketches might get into issues due to little knowledge of the program - I for myself had to find several detail solutions which keep the mockup close to the original look and to stay producable - ( and it is far from beeing cost and wear optimized ) so you would have a lot to do to get from the sketches to a produceable model ... My mockup data is not for share but just to show you what to get out of this process... Time I needed was 1:15 h until this state ... time I estimated to need was 45min . For a beginner probably several days of trial and error... without implementing the necessary functional dimensions and tolerances. Your strap (22mm) appears still too narrow for that case size

View attachment 6567034
Ahh yes it would definitely be a learning curve. I can see it being doable but it will definitely take a lot of time. I know what you mean with creating a watch that is different from the ones out there. I have an idea that might be pretty unique but I will have to see. I do like what you have done with my sketches I think this would look very nice with something that like you stated differentiates my brand from others. Im looking to keep my brand within a specific niche and creating a good story to go along with it. What I am trying to figure out now is a model name for my first series of watches. I have an idea of naming the model as follows, ex. mountaineer, climber, Ascend, or Ascent. Also I was thinking of using altitudes as the models for the watches ex. the highest peaks of the Carpathian Mountains. The reason behind these names is the fact that Carpathia came from the Carpathian Mountains in Europe and the Bird which is a stork as part of the logo represents the Bird from my hometown near the mountains. Now I do realize the type of watch I have is more of a classy watch than a sporty watch but the idea I have is to make something that will allow you to use it as both. I will like to release 1 model, 4 watches with different color variations.

They are as follows.
-Rose Gold case, hands, crown and navy blue dial.
-Chrome case, hands,crown with rose gold/salmon dial such as vintage delbana chronographs circa 1940.
-Brushed Gold case,hands,crown with black dial.
-Matte Black case , hands, crown, with off white dial.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I do agree with you that the strap looks too narrow. it would definitely need to be bigger. As far as the movement I would be working the design of the case, dimensions etc. around the ETA 2836-2 movement http://www.sapphytimes.com/wimages/2836-2.jpg. I can definitely make a bigger case but then have to produce a bigger spacer ring inside the case to keep the movement in place. Thanks for all of the input and help I really appreciate it!
 

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Analog watch Watch Fashion accessory Silver Material property
Just for information - there is a process going on which might make it difficult in near future ,-when it comes to availlability of ETA movements and parts for the common market .. 2836 - not sure if there are pendants outside .. could be an idea to eventually think about an available alternative ...

About the current watch --- it unifies elements of a marriage ( size and crown) B-watch size and case shape and dress watch ( hands and dial ) but it ist too large for a dress watch to be worn below a dress and the strap does not fit to a B-watch
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
View attachment 6569378 Just for information - there is a process going on which might make it difficult in near future ,-when it comes to availlability of ETA movements and parts for the common market .. 2836 - not sure if there are pendants outside .. could be an idea to eventually think about an available alternative ...

About the current watch --- it unifies elements of a marriage ( size and crown) B-watch size and case shape and dress watch ( hands and dial ) but it ist too large for a dress watch to be worn below a dress and the strap does not fit to a B-watch
If that is a problem then I can definitely use a different movement in the future. From experience i have had several of these movements and they have been very reliable.

I am no sure what you mean by B-watch can you be more specific.

Thank you,
Mark
 

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In Germany it is called Beobachtungsuhr If you would look at old Hanhart or Hamilton or similar avionic or military watches...

Quasi-copied or evolved in design "some thousand times"...... until it became an own watch style Branche . Big dial - normally solid lume indexes to be seen at night. Big crown to be handled with gloves, long and strong wristband to be worn over the pilots overall - Very rigid
/ robust design .

http://uhrforum.de/attachments/3238...-kleiner-sekunde-made-in-germany-dsc01473.jpg

https://www.bing.com/images/search?...806369e30a51d6f951464c46f5d5d2fco0&ajaxhist=0
 

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I would suggest not using a strap size like 19mm- straps sized 15,17,19mm are hardly available anywhere and narrow the watch owner's choice of strap. Typical sizes are even numbers like 16, 18, 20, 22mm. If these narrow (compared to the case diameter) lugs are to be 22mm, then the watch itself will be large enough to be hardly wearable. That's at least 50mm going by how it looks in the picture, and 47mm is already monstrous. That's pocket watch size territory. Art-deco style case? Surely a nice idea. The only vintage wristwatch with a diameter over 50mm (55, to be precise) was the original Stowa Flieger, but even this seems to have been designed to be worn over the pilot's coat/oufit, not directly on the wrist.

In other words- such watches look good only if someone has a monstrous wrist. Otherwise, it's like a wall clock with a strap. Which makes no sense, really. Although that's putting it mildly- it's not even massive, it's an abomination. Maybe it's fashionable now, but neither practical nor comfortable. Just my opinion.

The design itself is really simple and nice, but really would benefit from changing the proportions between the lug size and the diameter. Also, a size south of 43mm would be much better. If you want a transparent case back, and from the technical drawings so it appears, then keep in mind, that compared to the massive case size any ETA or Sellita automatic movement will look really small. So will any Soprod. And with ETA ceasing to supply anyone outside the Swatch Group, Sellita and Soprod are your only choices, should you want the movement to be a Swiss one.

Even when I have a look at my 43mm Edox, the position of the balance wheel of the ETA 2824 inside it indicates, where approximately the movement ends, and the case starts. And the space between the edge of the movement and the outer edge of the case is MASSIVE.
The ETA 2836 is a 11.5''' size movement, which is around 25-26mm. So is the 2824.
These calibres were originally designed for watches with the size typical for men's watches all the way between the 1930s and the 1990s. And that range started with 28-30mm to 38mm tops, with an exception for tool watches- diver watches, racing or aviator-style chronographs. Even the Rolex Submariner, which is quite a chunky tool watch, measures only 40mm. The late 1960s Omega Speedmaster "Moonwatch" was considered a large tool watch, and it measures...42mm.

Therefore, my suggestions would be:
Use a date only or no-date movement. Day-date causes too many things to happen in this design at the same time. Which some like- I don't (that's just my opinion).
Reduce size.
Change lugs/case size proportions.

I really like the logo, both the font and the side view of a stork in flight.
 

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You are right: I did the model just after the sketches of the previous page - and not for the real look/ size but just to show the process

For a 22mm strap the case would be rather 58mm diameter usable only on a belt around your belly! And not effortable due to a 53mm domed Saphire crystal.... !
 
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