[yesterdayshero]

I've been looking for my first mechanical watch and have narrowed it down to the following (prices in Australian dollars):

• Archimede Pilot 39H - $730
• Stowa Flieger No Logo - $1,200

I'm leaning towards the Archimede as it fits into my budget a little better and I'm struggling to justify the extra money for the Stowa. The Stowa ends up costing me extra in tax as it's over $1000 (tax included in the above cost). I've had a look at Steinhart, but most of their watches are larger than 40-42mm, which I think is the most my tiny wrists can handle. If you have any other suggestions feel free to share them.

a) Is the Stowa worth the extra $470? (What I'm really getting at is, will I regret not going with the Stowa?)

b) Do you think a Pilot watch is a good place to start what will hopefully turn into a collection?

 

[Quartersawn]

I think you will be happy with either one. The Stowa does have a top movement and a slightly domed crystal which is a big step up from flat sapphire IMO.

I am not sure you are looking at the right price. Outside of the EU the Stowa is about 745 euros shipped, that comes out to 1036 AUD give or take a few bucks.

 

[Drumguy]

They both have the same movement.I've read good things about both brands on WUS so it depends on how much you want to spend (i'm sure more knowledgeable fans of both brands will chime in with why you should buy one over the other)if the price isn't a problem then buy the one you like the most and if you like pilot watches then why not make your first purchase one.

 

[Quartersawn]

They both have the same movement.I've read good things about both brands on WUS so it depends on how much you want to spend (i'm sure more knowledgeable fans of both brands will chime in with why you should buy one over the other)if the price isn't a problem then buy the one you like the most and if you like pilot watches then why not make your first purchase one.

Actually, the Archimede is a standard (or perhaps Elabore) grade 2824-2 and the Stowa is a Top grade 2824-2 with blued screws.

The Stowa also has heat blued hands as seen below. Archimede used to be chemically blued but I understand they are moving up to heat blued. Their website does not specify so I do not know if they have changed yet.

 

[bar2020]

I personally would go for the Stowa. I think it is worth the extra money, and in the long run I think it will keep your interest longer than the Archimede.

 

[Watchbreath]

Stowa, less accident prone crown.

 

[gward4]

I have two Stowas and they are both remarkable watches for the price. I would vote for Stowa based on the slightly domed crystal and heat blued hands.

 

[mpalmer]

If you have the money, I'd go with the Stowa all the way...

 

[yesterdayshero]

I am not sure you are looking at the right price. Outside of the EU the Stowa is about 745 euros shipped, that comes out to 1036 AUD give or take a few bucks.

It's actually around 765 euros shipped, but then I'll get taxed 10% once it gets to Australia, as it's a purchase over $1,000. That's how I got to roughly $1,200.

 

[Nikoloz]

I once had that choice and my money went toward Stowa.
partly because they have that historical heritage linked with pilot watches, and partly because they are a true watch company (they do cases, as well as decoration in house, then there is some modifications they also do in house - which in my opinion is a huge deal for a company that sells couple of thousand watches per year.
Archmede is also well respected brand here but lacks that little detailing that Stowa has, so it is definitely worth the extra bucks.

And it is also very surprising to hear how local import taxes works (i believe for most countries if there is a deductible amount, like in this case 1000, you pay taxes only on difference - or else it would not make much sense
for example if i buy 999 equivalent of goods i will not pay taxes - but if i buy 1001 dollar goods I have to pay = 1001 - 1000 deductible amount = 1 dollars worth of taxes 1 * 10% = 0.10 p

is it not like that in aus?

 

[Bradjhomes]

I would go for the Stowa. Based on the Stowa's I've owned, it will be well worth it.

 

[Wibbs]

Another vote for the Stowa here FWIW. Both are remarkably nice quality for that price point, but the Stowa has an overall extra "feel" to it.

 

[yesterdayshero]

It's sounding like Stowa is the better watch, it now just comes down to how much I can spend on it. I know I shouldn't, but I keep thinking about my next watch and the money that could go towards that. Really I should just focus on the current purchase and not rush myself into the next one before making the first!

Your explanation regarding the tax makes sense, unfortunately tax is something that rarely makes sense! In Australia we have GST of 10% (which is like VAT), but for overseas purchases you only get charged if the value of the item is over $1,000. If it is, then you pay tax on the whole amount. So in your example, a $1,001 purchase would become $1100.10.

 

[GlennO]

I own an Archimede and am biased in favour of their excellent value for money. But I have also rarely heard a bad word about Stowa. From those who have owned both the often expressed comparison is that the Archimede's Ickler made case is of a slightly higher standard but the Stowa has a slight edge in movement grade, hands and dial. The Archimede has a wait time of 2 weeks. It's worth checking the wait time on the Stowa before ordering. You really can't go wrong with either choice.

 

[Henry S]

Unless the extra cost is truly a dealbreaker, I'd go with the Stowa. The upgraded movement is more an aesthetic thing, but in the long run, you'll appreciate the sapphire crystal. Also, the crown on the Archimede doesn't flow right for me.

 

[BostonWatcher]

I own an Archimede and am biased in favour of their excellent value for money. But I have also rarely heard a bad word about Stowa. From those who have owned both the often expressed comparison is that the Archimede's Ickler made case is of a slightly higher standard but the Stowa has a slight edge in movement grade, hands and dial. The Archimede has a wait time of 2 weeks. It's worth checking the wait time on the Stowa before ordering. You really can't go wrong with either choice.

Having owned an Archimede and seeing and handling the Stowa on a couple of occasions, the above is bang on. Personally, the case execution is very important to me and the dial and hands are so close in quality that it didn't matter. Archimede all the way for me.

Gratuitous pic....

 

[SomeAssemblyRequired]

I will join wschofield3 here and be a contrarian who favors the Archimede for several reasons. First, history. As documented in other threads, the actual link of present day Stowa to the original is tenuous at best. Second, the Archimede Ickler case is top notch. Third, the Archimede can be ordered with a domed crystal for an extra AUS$150 or thereabouts. Fourth, the price advantage of the Archimede trumps the minuscule differences in movements. And I will add a fifth: based on my experience, customer service at Archimede is among the best in the business. IMO the Archimede belongs in the Value Hall of Fame for watchmakers.

 

[Quartersawn]

I will join wschofield3 here and be a contrarian who favors the Archimede for several reasons. First, history. As documented in other threads, the actual link of present day Stowa to the original is tenuous at best. Second, the Archimede Ickler case is top notch. Third, the Archimede can be ordered with a domed crystal for an extra AUS$150 or thereabouts. Fourth, the price advantage of the Archimede trumps the minuscule differences in movements. And I will add a fifth: based on my experience, customer service at Archimede is among the best in the business. IMO the Archimede belongs in the Value Hall of Fame for watchmakers.

Can you link to a thread showing "the actual link of present day Stowa to the original is tenuous at best"? I'm genuinely curious. Walter Storz's heirs sold the business to Jorg Schauer as documented here: https://www.watchuseek.com/f295/stowa-history-overview-119824.html

Except for a change in ownership in 1996 (something that happens everyday with a publicly traded company as people buy and sell stock) I don't see anything that makes that argument valid. If I am mistaken please enlighten me.

 

[SomeAssemblyRequired]

Can you link to a thread showing "the actual link of present day Stowa to the original is tenuous at best"? I'm genuinely curious. Walter Storz's heirs sold the business to Jorg Schauer as documented here: https://www.watchuseek.com/f295/stowa-history-overview-119824.html

Except for a change in ownership in 1996 (something that happens everyday with a publicly traded company as people buy and sell stock) I don't see anything that makes that argument valid. If I am mistaken please enlighten me.

Stowa was an original producer of Fliegers and does have a long, bumpy ride through history that continues to this day. I'll stand corrected in that my remark seemed to discount that link to the past. To fine tune it though, aside from appearance there is little relationship between most of the Fliegers produced in 1939 (especially the 55mm case!) and those offered by the dozens of watchmakers offering variants of the pilot watch now.

 

[blowfish89]

Both watches look the same from the front, so I myself would pick the Archimede and pocket the extra cash. In fact, I already did - but the blue dial 42 for me. The Archimede has a nice case made in Germany and is slightly thinner than the Stowa. The Stowa will have a better decorated movement with perlage and blued screws but half of it is blocked by the rotor, so would prefer a handwound Unitas-based Flieger if going for Stowa myself.

And yes, a pilot watch is a superb way to start a collection - it can be a sports watch, it can be dressy, it can be casual or formal. I have three fliegers/pilots now, and plan to add a couple more in due time - its becoming my favorite genre.