WatchUSeek Watch Forums banner

1 - 13 of 13 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys,

Thanks in advance for any help given.

One of my cousins gave to me, today, this pocketwatch that was at my grandfather's sister house. She has passed away a couple of years back and was very dear to everyone in the family.

I showed to my grandfather the watch and he thinks the watch belonged to his father before beloging to his sister, so it's a old and family watch.
I don't realy care if it's rare or expensive one, being a watch that belonged to my great grandfather is enough to make me want to restore it.











Not knowing anything about pocket watches i come to everyone here for help. I am interest to know anything about the brand. Did they made the watch? Did they just put the brand on the dial? Any help would be much appreciated.

Cheers,

Sifion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,743 Posts
Hi and welcome.

I don't know much about pocket watches, but according to Mikrolisk the case was made by J. Breguet-Breting Fils Mikrolisk - The horological trade mark index and that trademark was first registered in 1910.

'Chronometre Noble' isn't listed there, but perhaps someone else will know of it. The movement doesn't look to be in good condition and isn't of the highest quality - so getting the watch restored may prove to be difficult. I can't ID the movement - but, again, perhaps someone else will be able to.:)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sifion

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Thanks, it's a start.

Google translate from that page says that J.B.B was from Biel, Swiss. Not much about the brand on google but i think they made only cases, found a gold longines with a JBB case.

That wave pattern is something i've never seen and might give away the maker, hopefully someone will know what movement is.

It is in bad shape, i know. I think it has been locked up for a better part of at least 40 years. I think i know a company that might restore it though. Just wanted to find out about it before sending it away.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,566 Posts
The movement is indeed in a very poor shape due to rust. It also seems to be a 7 Jewel movement, making it the lowest grade. Definitely not worth the expense of restoration unless desired for sentimental reasons.

It also looks like the hands are not original, and that the 4th wheel long pivot was broken by some "watchmaker" in the past (no second hand).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
The movement is indeed in a very poor shape due to rust. It also seems to be a 7 Jewel movement, making it the lowest grade. Definitely not worth the expense of restoration unless desired for sentimental reasons.

It also looks like the hands are not original, and that the 4th wheel long pivot was broken by some "watchmaker" in the past (no second hand).
I thought the hands were a little strange. The minute hand seems a little too short for the case.

It does have a sentimental value, but i got no rush in restoring it.

I want to find out as much as possible before sending it to restoration, might make it easier and cheaper also.

The balance spring is pretty much useless i think, kinda of distorted because the balance plate is loose. The spring is some blueish metal, got no ideia if it might help...

The dial got red 13- 24h markings that are faded also.

Thanks for the coments.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,566 Posts
I thought the hands were a little strange. The minute hand seems a little too short for the case.

It does have a sentimental value, but i got no rush in restoring it.

I want to find out as much as possible before sending it to restoration, might make it easier and cheaper also.

The balance spring is pretty much useless i think, kinda of distorted because the balance plate is loose. The spring is some blueish metal, got no ideia if it might help...

The dial got red 13- 24h markings that are faded also.

Thanks for the coments.
I wasn't sure about the hairspring, but since it is destroyed, my recommendation is not to restore the watch, unless you are willing to pay several hundreds of $ (even if you are lucky enough to find someone qualified to carry out necessary repairs).

I'd just keep it as is, for the memories.
 

·
Vint. Forum Co-Moderator
Joined
·
3,638 Posts
I disagree, this most certainly is not a seven jewel movement. it is most likely fifteen as only the centre wheel is unjewelled and is a low to mid range movement. I would judge this to be probably Twenties to Thirties in date, though I agree too that the hands are replacements. To assume that the fourth wheel pivot is broken is something of an assumption as these often lose the seconds hand without having the relatively large pivot broken.

The major issue is hairspring and this turns it from likely a simple service (assuming no rust issues under the plates) to something harder. Getting a replacement hairspring will not be a simple matter and would require time. So I would agree that this won't be a cheap fix.

The 'wave' pattern was common and tells us little about who made it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,566 Posts
It certainly looks like a 7 J movement on my iPad, but I checked on my bigger screen laptop, and it could be a 15J movement, however, the jewels are either crushed, or extremely dirty/dusty. Also, if you look at the pallet fork bridge, it doesn't look like a jewel, but a metal bushing. Also, rust damage looks more severe than I originally thought. I would be very surprised if the dial side wasn't rusty as well.
Which is a moot point, considering that a new hairspring would need to be found and vibrated for this balance wheel (I would assume that the balance staff would also need to be located or turned). We are talking about hairspring vibration, balance wheel truing/poising, possibly replacing cracked balance jewels, possibly replacing cracked jewels elsewhere, possibly replacing rusted parts (some may be salvaged), possibly replacing dial side parts, locating and installing new mainspring...
Locating appropriate set of hands + possibly attending to a broken 4th wheel pivot is another thing. Judging from the overall appearance of this movement, what we see on the surface is just the beginning.

So even if it was a 15J movement, I wouldn't make much of a difference. In fact, it can be jeweled to 15 if so desired (at a significant cost).

My 2 cents...
 

·
Vint. Forum Co-Moderator
Joined
·
3,638 Posts
The jewels are clear which is why they are not obvious and all appear to be present. I have quite a number of watches from this era in very similar condition. Until a watchmaker starts digging in, it's very hard to say just how bad it really is - or isn't. All of the items listed are pretty standard restoration items in a watch of this era. Value is subjective.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for the replies guys. It is helping!!

Sad to hear the pattern is a common feature though, since i'm not going to do any disassembly on my own i can't tell if theres any other markings on the movement.

The Watch case is 48mm and the movement is 33-34mm.

I don't realy know if the hairspring is destroied or not, but to me it seems at least unshaped, no ideia if it can be shaped back to use.

I know people that are qualified to restore it, without any doubt, i just want to find out more about the watch before sending it to him. Might save me time and money.

I took these other pictures. The balance whell and the hairspring, that is somewhat blue.

DSC01075.jpg
DSC01077.jpg

Thanks for the help so far guys.

Cheers,

Sifion.
 

·
Vint. Forum Co-Moderator
Joined
·
3,638 Posts
Hairspring may be salvageable based on those photos, however it appears to be missing the lower pivot and a balance screw. Since you don't appear to have experience in watchmaking, I would suggest that you don't do any further work yourself on a watch that you may want to keep. You need to get this into the hands of a watchmaker who can give you an opinion because it's impossible to tell from the photos the extent of the work that is going to be needed, especially as we can't see how extensive the rust is in the movement.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
I'm not doing anything by myself.

The balance plate was loose already, i just removed it from the watch to take the pictures.

My plan was just to gather info about the watch before sending it away to repair. Dont think i'll find anything about the movement nor the brand before it's open though.

It will take some time before i sent it to repair, i want to have money just for it, since i know it might go up to several hundreds to restore it. Until them, the search for info continues.

Cheers,

Sifion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,566 Posts
Looking at your latest pictures, the balance staff is broken and will need to be replaced. The balance wheel appears to be in a good condition. The impulse jewel appears to be intact. The good news is that the hairspring seems to be salvageable and rust-free. As I stated earlier, the most challenging issue would have been vibrating a new hairspring (I seriously doubt it is possible to locate a NOS balance complete or even a hairspring complete for this particular movement). So that's good news. If you are not a watchmaker, please be very careful putting the balance back in place, as you could cause additional tangling to the hairspring.
Good luck with your watch and let us know if you decide to proceed with the restoration and don't forget to show us the end result. Cheers!
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
Top