You don’t own the watch….the original loser, or his insurers, own the watch, and will get it back, therefore you have lost the money, and the seller should refund you.

If he doesn’t, then in the UK he is liable to prosecution for handling stolen goods, ignorance is no defence in UK law.

 

No advice I can give, but your tale of woe reaffirms why I would never buy a high end watch from anyone but a legit dealer.

 

That’s a big can of worms. I find it hard to believe that they’re going to repair a “stolen” watch and send it back to you.

 

Well I don't believe they would charge you, and then confiscate the watch as stolen, but it seems a strange way for Oris to deal with you.

 

Yikes, I don't think this is going to end well. You'll probably end up losing money. As others have said hard to believe Oris will work on a stolen watch and send it back.

 

The more I think about it, I do have advice. Get it in writing from Oris that they will not confiscate the watch.

 

Just because you bought it via a legitimate transaction doesn’t negate the fact that the watch is stolen property.
Personally I would send it back to the seller as is, ASAP and recover your money. Wash your hands of this mess.

 

Agreed, I think this is your best course of action.

 

you should contact ebay and discuss it with them and see what they say. I might also suggest lawyering up to determine what if any rights you might - or might not - have.

if it was indeed stolen on its way to a dealer, the watch should have been reported to their (or the carrier's) insurance, in either case it seems to me an insurance company somewhere owns that watch and insurance companies being insurance companies, once that claim is reopened, they're gonna want their watch back (or maybe offer it to you at a reduced rate but that means you paid for it twice)

 

you should contact ebay and discuss it with them and see what they say. I might also suggest lawyering up to determine what if any rights you might - or might not - have.

if it was indeed stolen on its way to a dealer, the watch should have been reported to their (or the carrier's) insurance, in either case it seems to me an insurance company somewhere owns that watch and insurance companies being insurance companies, once that claim is reopened, they're gonna want their watch back (or maybe offer it to you at a reduced rate but that means you paid for it twice)

For sure……

No way the title to that watch belongs to the OP.

And Oris will not return it to him….period.

 

Me thinks the AD that originally owned the watch dumped it to a grey-market dealer and told Oris that it was stolen instead, at $10K this seems like a top-of-the-line Oris model that may be specially treated in the AD contracts, prohibiting them from reselling it to grey dealer but they managed to find a "solution"....

 

What gets me is a stolen Oris. As nice as they are, really? And the number of transactions on that unusual watch. But then again tons of brands are being counterfeited now, not just Rolex and high end brands.

I’d get my money back from the dealer and be done with it. Since you really trust the dealer and have used and enjoyed the watch for a while, not getting back 100% of what you paid is a reasonable middle ground. You need to start over.

 

If it was stolen before it ever reached the dealer it could have been stolen by thieves that weren't 100% sure what they were stealing, like shipping company or airport employees. If they see a box or pallet coming from Switzerland and something else to indicate the cargo is Swiss watches they would know it's valuable enough to profit from without knowing the brand.

 

You should not get legal advice from a watch forum, especially when some members are not in your jurisdiction.

If the original seller won’t take it back and issue a full refund, you should consult with an attorney. If that will cost more than the cost of the watch it may be easier to just walk away.

 

Eventually ask a lawyer and don't listen to anyone here.

 

I don't know what lawyers cost in France but around here, the OP my just gift him the watch for his answer......

 

Return the watch and request refund if seller is offering it. If not, then contact ebay. It was not his watch to sell. It is not your watch to repair either. That said, it feels rather weird that Oris is telling you that they won't confiscate the watch that is reported as "stolen" in their database. If it is marked, it should also have contact information of either insurance or owner who reported it stolen.

 

i agree i thought that was weird.

 

1. Send it back to the seller for refund (if he is not willing to do it contact the police)
2. In the future limit yourself buying watches from manufacturers/ADs/boutiques, maybe private persons for used/preloved pieces (when original warranty card/invoice/etc. is available.)

 

Police will not do anything about it here. And statute of limitations is 5 years in my state. OP bought watch 4 years ago. If it was reported stolen to Oris, could have easily been over 5 years ago.

 

Maybe next time don’t buy a watch off eScam……?

 

Hmm yeah maybe,.. tho to be fair I’ve gotten quite a few watches via eBay with only a few problems…

 

Return it for a refund and let the seller deal with it.

 

You could always opt for this method. Aside from the gest, I'm sorry to hear about your dilemma. I only have 1 maybe 2 watches that would be considered luxury. I bought from an AD only to avoid an issue like you're having. I hope it ends well for you!!

https://www.watchuseek.com/threads/a-4000-mistake.5554959/page-2?post_id=57688113&nested_view=1&sortby=oldest#post-57688113

 

What’s the point of having a stolen watch list with Oris if when they find a watch, they don’t give it to you but instead repair it and give it back to the thief. I think if you send it in, it’s as good as gone.

 

i agree i thought that was weird.

I echo what @Seabee1 said and contact eBay to see what they have to say about the matter before moving forward with anything. I would also hold off on taking any action which would put more layers between me and the watch (ie. don't send to Switzerland for service).

In a perfect world everything would be able to be worked out between Oris, the buyer, and the seller via email but we don't live in a perfect world.

It could be the case that all parties involved are providing honest stories but regardless, I wouldn't want to be the one left holding the bag.

In this case I would see if eBay has some kind of stolen property recovery program, send the watch to eBay, get a refund from eBay, and let eBay, the seller, and Oris deal with things between themselves.

FWIW this is why I've moved away from buying high-dollar watches from anything but big sellers. I would rather pay a slight premium than potentially have to deal with these kinds of issues.

 

Wow, what a mess. Everyone's nightmare. And of course depending on state is there a statute of limitations involved as it has now been four years since purchase?

This one's above my paygrade so I'm afraid I have zero advice on how to proceed.

 

Is it just me here who thinks the only problem the OP really has is that the stem does not set the time on the watch anymore ?

From what I understand, nobody else has a claim over the watch , it's still in his possession...

And about the problem with the keyless mechanism, there could be no new parts needed to fix it, there might be a watchmaker who agrees to work on the watch for a reasonable price, and all this sending to Switzerland thing wouldn't matter (which will probably take half a year on top of everything else )....

 

I'm inclined to agree....

I don't believe anyone is actually looking for this watch. Yes, by the letter of the law, the watch is reported stolen....by an AD who's intentions we have no idea. Was it stolen, or was it reported stolen? What was the end result of all this? A series of transactions happened until it fell into the OP's lap who has now owned it for 4 years and it needs a service. I agree, you may just need to find the right watchmaker. I really am inclined to think that Oris would not intentionally lie about sending back a watch for repair, but I would get it in writing if you choose that route.

I may be wrong, but I don't think anyone is looking for this watch. I think that as far as all the parties involved in the initial transaction are concerned, the matter is closed. The cost to send police, involve insurance...what? For a watch? That's broken and years old? Yeah, ok....no

Specifics were not laid out about what the seller on eBay said they were willing to do. Doesn't seem like they were really a part of all this. I'm not sure I would ask anything more of them. They sold it, you bought it and until all this....you were happy with that transaction.

You've owned this watch for 4 years now. It's yours....I'd just leave it at that. Now if you have some moral compass that makes that difficult....that's for you to decide. Personally, if it were me, I wouldn't see this as anything more than trying to straighten out the broken watch and the rest is just the history of the watch.

I can see I'm in the minority in this thinking.....I suppose there will be some sort of onslaught unto my own moral compass.

 

thx guys, this is a lot of good advice. 🙏

 

See other forum a "$4000" mistake, he might loan you his hammer! ( ;

 

First thing I would have done is to contact Ebay not the seller. The good thing is the Ebay seller is still online. I am sure they have experience with this and have already developed a process. Second thing is Oris has authenticated the watch but it was reported stolen? Am I clear on this? If that is in fact the case, then as pointed out above the watch belongs to the original owner. Who is the original owner? I think you are obligated to return the watch. I am fairly certain that if you send the watch to Oris they will not return it to you. If you keep it you can not sell it. My advice is to contact Ebay and make them aware and go from there.

 

Not a good situation to be in here. Sounds like there will be some pain in this no matter how you look at it. You knowingly are in possession of a stolen watch is not a good place to be and I would send it back to the seller ASAP and get a refund, in full in my opinion. Not your fault the seller bought it from the gray market and it was stolen. You paid for a watch that was not stolen and you were sent one that was so I feel you deserve a full refund.

Personally I would not keep a stolen watch.

 

This isn't legal advice, but note that it depends on the jurisdiction. In CA, if you are a bonafide purchaser for value of a good that later turns out to be stolen, you are not liable if you were not aware that the property you were buying was stolen. In other words, the law in CA does not blame the buyer if the buyer had no clue. Put another way, a prosecutor would have to prove that you knew you were buying stolen property if they wanted to convict you in any way.

Now that's the law, and it's intended to be fair to the buyer, who one can argue, was equally swindled in the sale.

However, this is a far cry from the moral aspects of owning something that you now know is stolen, and the potential headache that might come up if the party to whom the good was stolen from, is notified by Oris that they have found the stolen property and give them your name and address. You would then have to deal with them. If they are cooperative with you, they may ask for the watch back and compensate you for loss, and then pursue the eBay seller and/or the person the seller bought the watch from....etc.

Or they could make your life difficult and make you prove you didn't know it was stolen and pursue other means.

At the end of the day, if it was me, I'd find a way to return the property and not send it in to Oris for repair. I would never feel comfortable knowing for sure the watch was stolen. It would never feel like it was truly my watch. I also wouldn't want to deal with any potential blowback from owning this watch.