You can pull the battery or wait three days.

 

Hi all

It's some time since I posted here. I hope someone can help with my question.

I have just acquired a new Longines VHP watch. When it arrived, the seconds were running 2 seconds fast, but I left it alone as I read here and elsewhere that the hands would auto-correct. Will they did, in a manner of speaking, as the second hand, when hacked, now sits at the 56 second marker. Also, although the time seems correct to the second, the watch is pulsing the minute hand at 06, 16, 26, 36, 46 and 56 seconds. I have read the procedure for 'VHP Battery Guide' sticky and note the re-synchronisation info but I am loath to pull the battery if this is something that will self-correct. The question is - is there any way to 'Force' the HPD function to operate rather than wait 3 days for it to kick in before I can tell if there is a real problem?

Thanks for any information you can provide.

A lot of people have had this sort of problem, but we have not found a way to force or expedite synchronisation of the hands.
You could pull the battery, but removing the battery-cover is a bit tricky.
I think that the best plan is to wait for ( up to ) 3 days and see if GPD cures the problem.

If minutes and seconds hand do not 'park' at 12

• after GPD
• when the watch is in power-save mode

The only solution that I know of is to return the watch to Longines.
Please let us know how you get on
Dave

 

I realise this thread is a bit old, but this might help someone. I bought a pre-owned Conquest VHP 3 hand and date, which had both the OPs issue with alignment of the second hand in power saving mode, and, I couldn't adjust the date to better than actual +1 day, despite all the useful info here at WatchuSeek.

So the watch went to the local service centre (I live quite close to it) and I've decided to leave it for a partial service for a number of reasons. But, and here's the kicker, the service team have kindly provided written instructions to me on how to adjust the hands and date myself in the future by entering the 'Settings' mode without removing the watch battery. I can't vouch for this, of course, and if you want to try it, you are on your own. I would try it as a last resort if I found myself in a similar position in future, before returning the watch to the service centre again (kerching!).

My watch is model L3.716.4.56.6 and I have been told the movement is no. "288.2".

"Longines VHP Settings mode:

To enter settings mode, push the crown 4 short pushes and wait 2 seconds. Then, push the crown 3 short pushes and wait 2 seconds, then push the crown 2 short pushes and wait 2 seconds. The hands will all move to 12. If they don’t, try the pattern again, adjusting the speed of the pushes.

Once in settings mode, you can re-align the hands or you can amend the date:

* Hand sync: Turn the crown so the hands show 5:30 and short press the crown. The hands will move to where they believe 12 is. If they’re misaligned, turn the crown so the hands are at 12 and short press the crown to adjust each hand.

* Date set up: Turn the crown so the hands show 1:30 and short press to enter this mode. The hands will display the date. In date set up mode:

[NB: I'm assuming that you adjust the relevant hand using the crown for each of the bullet points below. There was no guidance provided on that aspect of date adjustment].

• Short press to cycle between the hands and the date window.
• Hour hand: the tens of the year, i.e 2020 (points at 2)
• Minute hand: the units of the year i.e 2023 (points at 3)
• Second hand: month, i.e 7 = July
• Date window: day of the month

The date is a perpetual calendar so when set to the correct year, month and date, will not need adjusting – even when it comes to a leap year".

Good luck to anyone who wants to have a go.

 

Thank you Dave.

Well see what happens in a couple of days.

 

Just to wrap this up for anyone interested. After some discussion with the retailer. I handed the watch in for repair by Longines. It will take 12 weeks and the fact that the watch is new gets me no sympathy. With the benefit of hindsight, I should have availed myself of UK consumer law to return for refund and then bought a new one.

 

Not good !
Longines greatest asset is to be considered a 'prestige brand'.

• They sell a watch which ( I guess ) has not been correctly calibrated .
• They quote 3 months to repair it.

Product quality and customer service should be at the top of their priority list !

 

Well! Good news. I just got a call from Longines Boutique to tell me the watch has been repaired an I have arranged to collect it on Tuesday. So they quoted twelve weeks and managed four weeks. I guess someone had some sympathy even if the retailer didn't!

I still like the watch and feel reasonably sure the issue was just a one-off but I really think a 'prestige' brand should have a policy that if you buy a watch which is faulty out of the box or within the first few weeks, and it is clearly in perfect, unworn condition then you get a swap for a new watch.

Thanks for all the advice and support folks!

 

OK - that's it.

On inspection the repaired watch exhibits the same issue but with a 2 second offset rather than a 4 second one.

I've written to the retailer and Longines requesting a full refund.

Don't see another Longinees watch in my future!

 

I know I expect too much, but you would think that when a customer brings in a brand new timepiece that has a malfunction, that the servicing of that timepiece would be done with an extra level of detail to ensure the watch is perfect upon return. You would also think that the AD would, upon receipt of the repaired article, examine it to determine for themselves if the repair was executed correctly before summoning the owner to come pick it up.

Alas that has not been my experience with any brand of watch or any AD. I had about the same thing happen with my VHP Chrono. It had a very small hand alignment issue. Sent it in for warranty service. It came back with a very large hand alignment issue. How did it make it out of the service center? Did the AD even look at the watch upon receipt? There's no way they could have without realizing that the problem was literally 10 times worse.

A friend of mine said recently:

There is no such thing as pride in work. That died with our grandparents. Sad, but true.

While I don't think that what he said is categorically true - there are certainly individuals who take pride in their work - in general most people are just out there doing a job, day in and day out. From the moment they start their day at work they are focused on quitting time and the door.

It makes no difference to the repair person who serviced your watch. If you're disappointed with your sales and service experience with the brand he doesn't care. If the watch comes back a 2nd time, it doesn't matter. His 8-hour shift doesn't change. Same with the AD rep. You'd think that person might be a little more interested in your satisfaction. But unless you're some super high-dollar customer they just aren't. There will be another one of you that comes through the door in an hour. And if there isn't, they don't really care about that either.

While I certainly understand your frustration with the experience, quitting the brand might not serve a purpose if you like the products that the brand makes. I say this because I think most brands are going to be like this. I was frustrated out of my mind when the Seiko U.S. service center ruined my Grand Seiko SBGA375 that I sent in for warranty service. I wondered, "how can you continue to buy a brand if you have no way to have the thing serviced to your satisfaction?". I was VERY tempted to quit the brand.

But I'm just punishing myself if I do. Because I love Grand Seiko. And because, like I said, it seems that they are all this way. All you can do is learn from the experience, and continue to buy the timepieces that speak to you. I have 5 Grand Seiko watches now. I just bought the 5th one last month. If any of them need service in the future the process of documenting the condition of the watch prior to service will be done quite thoroughly. And if the U.S. service center damages it then I will drive everyone there insane until they make it right.

But you have to do what works for you.

 

appreciate the thoughful response @BrianBinFL even tho' it's not directed at me......

> And if the U.S. service center damages it then I will drive everyone there insane until they make it right.

this is/will be a lot of effort on your part! A lot of disruption to your daily life where you have to babysit an AD to ensure that the goods you paid hard-earned money for are treated the correct way (which shouldbe the default modus operandi but isn't). Maybe you have a lot of time? OR, you make time because of your love for GS? But, many won't go to that length because many other things in their lives supercede babysitting an AD (to ensure their watch comes back fixed correctly).......

 

appreciate the thoughful response @BrianBinFL even tho' it's not directed at me......

Thanks. Just trying to share my perspective now that some time has passed since some of the AD/service incidents that have vexed me.

this is/will be a lot of effort on your part! A lot of disruption to your daily life where you have to babysit an AD to ensure that the goods you paid hard-earned money for are treated the correct way (which shouldbe the default modus operandi but isn't). Maybe you have a lot of time? OR, you make time because of your love for GS? But, many won't go to that length because many other things in their lives supercede babysitting an AD (to ensure their watch comes back fixed correctly).......

But what is the alternative? Is there a brand out there where the service center always gets it right and the AD actually checks to see if things were done satisfactorily before telling you "it's done"?

I have never had to have one of my Rolex watches serviced. I presume the service experience there is at least a little better. But the annoying experience I had with my VHP Chrono coming back worse than it left was via an AD that is also a Rolex AD, and the sales rep who handled my service order also handles Rolex there. Now maybe she'd have done things differently if it was a Rolex and not a Longines - I can't say.

The perception I have been left with is that if you're going to own these things, and you have to depend upon their service center for repairs, then there is a good chance that it's going to be annoying if you need service. If anybody has a brand where the AD seems to care about the service being done right, and the service centers for that brand do a good job 99.9% of the time, that would be something worth examining.

But it won't matter if I don't like their watches.

 

Thanks for those replies.

My dad used to run a confectionary store. Very infrequently a customer would come in with a problem with his purchase. Dad always made sure that the customer left with a replacement item AND another gift item of good value as an apology. He always said he made sure the customer would return because he got good service.

It's also true, backed by detailed study, that customers are please more by quick and reliable resolution of a problem than by having no problems at all.

To me the purchase of a £1000 watch, albeit not at Rolex level, is a very significant spend and I do expect a measure of deluxe service at that price band. Sure didn't get that!!!

One huge issue with all kinds of customer service in these days of call centres and no real people to talk to, is that there is no-one who will take ownership of an issue and see it through for the customer.

I am, I confess, bitterly disappointed.

 

Just as I finished typing my previous post I received a text message from Longines. I mean, I hit the button to post it and my phone chimed the text message. Eerie. It was an update on my VHP that I sent in for service due to the rate not being to specification. Maybe I'll make a separate thread chronicling the direct warranty service experience it in the Longines forum. So far it's been good.

 

Since VHPs are discontinued, repair and QC are not very important?

 

Well, my warranty is for 5 years. So for 5 years it's the problem of the Swatch Group and Mayors Jewelers. After that I guess we'll see. In 5 years we may all have chronometer chips implanted in our heads.

 

I'm resurrecting this thread to update any interested parties and to give some information which might be useful.

I was prevailed upon to return the watch directly to Longines service department following the discovery of the second fault. The outcome was significantly different!

I was able to follow the work on my watch using their customer service system. They sorted it out in a week!

Following the initial diagnosis, the repair details showed as 'No fault found'. Naturally, I was enraged, as the fault was clearly present and, aside from the number of seconds in error, was exactly the same as the first problem.

I called the Customer Service line and got to speak to a very helpful lady who explained that they had 'just been given' new information on correcting misaligned hands without mechanical intervention. I say nothing about this 'new information' coming to light at the end-of-life of this model! She sent me the following information which appears to be a variation of the post-battery change procedure. I don't think this info is in any of the other threads but apologies if I'm duplicating.

Following our discussion, please see below for information on the hand setting for your Conquest VHP:

How to enter settings mode:

• Push the crown 4 times, then wait 2 seconds. Push the crown 3 times, then wait 2 seconds. Push the crown a further 2 times. If your timing is correct, all hands will spin and sit at 12. If not, try again but slow down / speed up your pushes.

Date set up:

• In setting mode, turn the crown so the hands show 1:30, and short press the crown. The hands will display the date.

Hand sync:

• Turn the crown until the hands show 5:30, and short press the crown. The hands will go to where the watch thinks 12 is – if misaligned, turn the hands to 12 using the crown, and adjust the hands from there. Short press the crown to select different hands to adjust. Push the crown in to set.

I have tried this procedure and confirmed that it allows me to deliberately mis-align the hands and then return them to correct alignment.

My watch is now working well but I could have done without the drama of the first two months of ownership!

Thanks for everyone's help, comments and interest.

 

I'm resurrecting this thread to update any interested parties and to give some information which might be useful.

I called the Customer Service line and got to speak to a very helpful lady who explained that they had 'just been given' new information on correcting misaligned hands without mechanical intervention. I say nothing about this 'new information' coming to light at the end-of-life of this model! She sent me the following information which appears to be a variation of the post-battery change procedure. I don't think this info is in any of the other threads but apologies if I'm duplicating.

Following our discussion, please see below for information on the hand setting for your Conquest VHP:

How to enter settings mode:

• Push the crown 4 times, then wait 2 seconds. Push the crown 3 times, then wait 2 seconds. Push the crown a further 2 times. If your timing is correct, all hands will spin and sit at 12. If not, try again but slow down / speed up your pushes.

Date set up:

• In setting mode, turn the crown so the hands show 1:30, and short press the crown. The hands will display the date.

Hand sync:

• Turn the crown until the hands show 5:30, and short press the crown. The hands will go to where the watch thinks 12 is – if misaligned, turn the hands to 12 using the crown, and adjust the hands from there. Short press the crown to select different hands to adjust. Push the crown in to set.

I have tried this procedure and confirmed that it allows me to deliberately mis-align the hands and then return them to correct alignment.

My watch is now working well but I could have done without the drama of the first two months of ownership!

Thanks for everyone's help, comments and interest.

Thanks for that, it is a big help.

I have edited the procedure to clarify a couple of operations
How to enter settings mode:

• Push the crown 4 times, then wait 2 seconds. Push the crown 3 times, then wait 2 seconds. Push the crown a further 2 times. If your timing is correct, all hands will spin and sit at 12. If not, try again but slow down / speed up your pushes.

Date set up:

• In setting mode, turn the crown so the hands show 1:30, and short press the crown. The hands will display the date :- seconds hand is month, 2:15 is year 23. After any adjustment Long push the crown to finish date-set

Hand sync:

• Turn the crown until the hands show 5:30, and short press the crown. The hands will go to where the watch thinks 12 is – if misaligned, turn the hands to 12 using the crown, and adjust the hands from there. Short press the crown to select different hands to adjust .Long push the crown to finish hand-set

Long push the crown to finish settings mode

When I get time I will add this procedure into my Battery change on the latest Longines VHP post
We are getting closer to a good repair manual. We now have procedures for :-

• date-setting
• hand setting

All that we need now is a procedure for rate-setting !

BrianBinFl also had a good service experience when his VHP was running fast.
Are Longines pulling their socks up ?
Or is there a different service department for 'discontinued' watches ?

 

Thanks @pieronip and @DaveM. We are indeed accumulating a good manual of configuration operations. The tantalizing thing is that I can't help but assume that things like rate adjustment are also among the settings that can be adjusted while in settings mode.

1:30 - set perpetual calendar data
5:30 - set hand positions

Might rate adjustment be one of the other X:30 positions?

I'm sure there is a PDF technical document for this movement that contains the procedures for everything that can be done in "setting mode". It would be wonderful if we could get our hands on it.

 

Yeah I'd love to know what all the other hand positions do. There's an awful lot of them you can scroll through in settings mode.

 

I tested the hand alignment mode on my VHP chrono and it allows for adjustment of the left sub-dial, the right sub-dial, the running seconds, the chrono seconds, and the minute hand. It does not seem to allow for adjustment of the hour hand (which I assume is slaved to the minute hand and therefore not independently adjustable).

When I put the watch in hand setting mode the date wheel advances to the Longines logo (which follows 31 on the date wheel). I'm sure that there is a setting mode that would allow fine tuning the position of the date within the window. That would be nice as mine is ever so slightly lower than I'd like it to be.

 

What I can adjust in the GMT flavored VHP is

• the sweep second hand, in single second increments
• the GMT hand, in 15 minute increments
• the minute hand, in 10 second increments

So, hands 'fine adjust' a single tick of the standard step of each adjustable hand as seen during the watch's operation. In 'hand setting' mode I did not see the date wheel move one bit, it stayed on today's date.

 

Really glad that this has been helpful!

 

I have 3 ( 2x3-hand and GMT ) and have played with them a bit more.
BrianBinFl, HiFi_Hound & MrDisco99 have checked theirs, so we have plenty of data.
Here are my results and thoughts :-

12:00 is used to force a hand-dance
Do a short-press to start the dance ( the press causes a short ‘click’ of the minutes hand, there is about 5 seconds delay before the dance starts )
At the end of the dance seconds hand moves to 10 to indicate ‘job done’
Another short press will repeat the dance, or time can be adjusted to go to the next routine
This is the normal procedure :-

• Short-press to run the routine
• Seconds moves to 10 at end of routine
• Short-press to repeat routine or adjust the time to go to next routine

12:10 moves all of the hands to zero
Short press to end the routine

12:20 Tests the date-wheel. It does some slow dancing and then moves to 1

01:00 Puts the watch in ‘new battery just fitted’ state. I managed to ‘kill’ the watch, but cycling the battery revived it.

01:30 is a useful one

02:00,05 and 15 play with the date.
Could be useful !
I am not sure, but think that the final date-alignment in the window is controlled by a ratchet.
There is no 5:30 to tune it !

I do not understand these !
I agree with MrDisco99, they look like version numbers, but why so many more for the simple 3-hander ?
The only variation was 3:35 for my first 3-hander.
It is an early one, I ordered it when the 'new VHP' was announced.
It works OK except for quite a lot of TC error

These could all be useful tests.
5:30 is the jewel in the crown !
I have found the same 'extra tests' for GMT as HiFi_Hound, but have not had time to look at them !

 

FYI I tried the full test at 1:10... it actually reset the time to midday, similar to the new battery process, so I had to set the time again after that.

The regular dancing hands calibration at 12:00 doesn’t do this and keeps the current time as set.

 

Doesn't the GMT movement have the ability to change the time for daylight savings? I seem to remember something about being able to set that through the phone app.

Maybe that's somewhere in the settings mode past 5:30... along with stuff relating to the light sensor.

 

Others have reported their watches take DST into consideration but mine didn't. I set it's time/date via the app well before the DST changeover in March. The app has no features I see in it that allows DST on/off, just setting the time zone. I assumed since I set my watch to the eastern time zone (New York City) it would turn on DST adjust but it didn't.

EDIT: I checked the app again and noticed a small icon next to location you pick for time zone. For home time zone I use New York City, it showed a small sun icon next to the city. The icon for GMT time zone it showed a snowflake. My GMT setting is for GMT time, I picked a location that didn't have DST changes. I'm assuming that sun/snowflake signifies a timezone is in DST or isn't.

Not sure if that makes a blessed bit of difference since in my case it didn't result in the watch advancing one hour back in March. Maybe to turn DST on/off you have to set the time with the app when DST is active? If so, that's a really crummy app design.

 

It’s great to see people managing to uncover the hidden settings in the VHP movements - I have a 36mm 3-hander and I imagine all of this will one day come in useful for maintenance… good work!

 

I'm having a strange issue with my 3 hander and would greatly appreciate help/advice in resolving it.

I changed the battery in January of this year and following the battery change everything worked as it should. However, when I changed the hour at the end of March to go to Daylight Saving the following morning the seconds hand had jumped forward 30 seconds. Following the procedure listed earlier in the thread I was able to reset the seconds hand correctly, however the following day the seconds hand had jumped forward 30 seconds so I repeated the process and that seemed to have worked. But on Saturday last I noticed that the seconds hand was 33 seconds ahead of where it should be so I repeated the process and this morning it was back to being 30 seconds forward again!

I'm guessing the 3 seconds difference was natural gain over the last 5 months or so but I can't work out why the sudden jump by 30 seconds! Following the process both the hour and minute hand jump to 12 but the seconds hand jumps to 6.

Any ideas what's happening and what I need to do to effect a permanent fix? Have I missed something or is there something else I should have done?

Many thanks in advance.

 

Following the process both the hour and minute hand jump to 12 but the seconds hand jumps to 6.

Seconds hand is misaligned. Go into the settings mode and realign the hands.

 

Your situation sounds sorta familiar. Mine started to do weird things soon after a battery change. Details here

https://www.watchuseek.com/threads/longines-vhp-and-daylight-saving-time.5529283/

Look at post #15.

The movement was defective in my case, Swatch replaced it and a year later now it only gained 3 sec in that time. The old movement gained 7 sec in a year.

A decent number of owners on this sub-forum have had warranty work needed (aka new movement), myself included with this 2017-vintage VHP movement. You rarely (more like never) hear of quartz movements dying in the first few years but not this model. That tells me something is twitchy/failure-prone in the design having been in the engineering design biz for decades (chip design to be more specific).

 

Thanks guys, appreciated. The watch keeps excellent time other than the seconds hand jumping forward 30 seconds.

Resetting it works initially and right now if I pull the crown out and leave it out then after 1 minute all hands return to 12 so it looks to be working as it should. I think the problem may be associated with what happens at 2 in the morning, (UK Time), when it goes through its automatic self check routine.

I'll see if it does it yet again tomorrow morning and if it does I'll reset the seconds hand again then set an alarm to watch what happens at 2 the following morning.

I wonder if it's worth me resetting the seconds hand then redoing the battery change routine per this thread?

Battery change on the latest Longines VHP

This is my procedure for battery-change on the current Longines VHP I have carried it out about 10 times on 3-hand and GMT models. Longines say that a watch will not ‘die’ until it has been more than 1 day without a battery, so you should not need to re-synchronize the date. But I think that the...

www.watchuseek.com

 

Quick Update

The watch is still correct this morning. Based on what I've done when it's happened it seems that I have to do the resetting process twice for it to take effect. Don't know how long it will last this time but I will keep an eye on it and update if/when it happens again. I wear the watch in rotation so it sits on a stand for much of its time.

Thanks again for the suggestions.

 

One thought I had is there's a 'stuck bit' in memory that only a completely fresh start may fix. That means the battery is left out for days to make sure the watch is completely reset internally.