WatchUSeek Watch Forums banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,558 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
We started discussing this in another thread, but I thought the concept should have it's own thread.

I really like the look of the Cleveland Express Dual Time. I really would like it to be a UTC, but the UTC window is linked to the main hand, and the second zone does not operate on a 24 hour scale, thus it is a dual time, but not a GMT as the second hour hand is not tied to a 24 hour scale.

So, as it stands, I would describe this model as a dual time with a military display linked to the main hour hand.


And now, the idea:think::

What if Ball would use the main time hand as a secondary zone since it is linked to the UTC Window. This hand would become the red hand. And since it operates in conjunction with the UTC window, we now have a true UTC/GMT function:-!

Now, for the main time zone…The hand that currently is used as a the second time zone, the "red hand," would now be painted green."

And there you have it...we have just made the Cleveland Express a true UTC/
GMT without having to change the design at all...just flip flop the hour hands.b-)

The hands could be flipped on any current watches, and then the factory would just follow suit going forward, installing the hands the "scottw44" way. No costs in manufacturing, no redesign needed…just taking the sum of the original parts and rearranging them to achieve a more complicated whole.


No fee necessary…Ball can send me a Cleveland Express if you like, with the hands flipped ala the “scottw44” method. Stainless is more than adequate;-)

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
510 Posts
Several good things may come out of this Scott....

Hopefully, there won't have to be a production dial change from UTC wording to UMT as there is for the Night Train owners.

Searching for the movement specs of the CE Dual Time. I can only find the NT: Ball Cal. 124 - modified ETA 2824

Perhaps it is as simple as using a modified cannon pin and second hour hand to make future generations of the Night Train a true UTC as well? :-! I could be wayyyy off too, and I think I am.

May need movement overhaul (centre cannon pin, crown assembly and Mvmt) into future generation s of the NT body. Where is Roberev when we want to experiment Franken-Trains?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,558 Posts
Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Several good things may come out of this Scott....

Hopefully, there won't have to be a production dial change from UTC wording to UMT as there is for the Night Train owners.

Searching for the movement specs of the CE Dual Time. I can only find the NT: Ball Cal. 124 - modified ETA 2824

Perhaps it is as simple as using a modified cannon pin and second hour hand to make future generations of the Night Train a true UTC as well? :-! I could be wayyyy off too, and I think I am.

May need movement overhaul (centre cannon pin, crown assembly and Mvmt) into future generation s of the NT body. Where is Roberev when we want to experiment Franken-Trains?

I thought of this Brandon, but was not sure if the intention of the NT is to be a 2 time zone watch as it would drive the price up.

Or maybe this isn't so expensive. I hope that we hear back from Ball on both concepts.

The other issue with the NT is current ownership and would there be more backlash. Maybe there could be two models initially and let the marketplace determine which one remains in the future?

Fun brainstorming with you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,558 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Steve made a good point in the previous thread about the hiding of the second hour hand.

So, back to the drawing board to evolve this a bit further to avoid any design necessity.

How about this:

We only use one hour hand on the watch. We remove the red hand for the second zone and replace it with the green hand in it's position.

Now the green hand tells us the home time and the UTC window could be used as a true GMT function. The stem function need not be changed and the watch to me, works perfectly, and the UTC window regains it's purpose.

Is that the trick?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,600 Posts
Ahhh... now you're cooking with Crisco...:-!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
94 Posts
Steve made a good point in the previous thread about the hiding of the second hour hand.

So, back to the drawing board to evolve this a bit further to avoid any design necessity.

How about this:

We only use one hour hand on the watch. We remove the red hand for the second zone and replace it with the green hand in it's position.

Now the green hand tells us the home time and the UTC window could be used as a true GMT function. The stem function need not be changed and the watch to me, works perfectly, and the UTC window regains it's purpose.

Is that the trick?
Or, you could just leave the watch as it is and just have a change of perspective (which you already did). Please check my recent reply in the previous thread.

Well, i might as well paste it here:

"Ok, I think i'm finally able to understand this watch better. Scott's perspective helps a lot in that it is NOT a GMT but just a watch that tells time in 2 places, and it's up to you to decide where in the world that second place is.

I have a feeling it was designed as a "nostalgic" piece, a throwback to the early Ball days with mainly the United States mainland's three time zones in mind, and therefore the red hour hand will only be either just a couple of hours ahead or behind the main hour hand, if you make that your "home time". This is probably how Ball pocket watches in the 1890s would have looked like if, for example, they wanted to simultaneously display the time at California and Chicago.

This watch is looking more and more interesting."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,558 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Thanx Jay. I guess the question is would Ball like to make this a true UTC? If so, I believe I have found a great solution.

I think it would open up the model to more discussion and create more awareness in the mid/high-high end WIS world.

That said, it is beautiful the way it is as well.

I think Ball standardized, or helped to standardize the time zones to the four we know today. I don't think he wanted a three zone world, but four.

I sent my note to Ball and I will be curious as to their thoughts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
94 Posts
Thanx Jay. I guess the question is would Ball like to make this a true UTC? If so, I believe I have found a great solution.

I think it would open up the model to more discussion and create more awareness in the mid/high-high end WIS world.

That said, it is beautiful the way it is as well.

I think Ball standardized, or helped to standardize the time zones to the four we know today. I don't think he wanted a three zone world, but four.

I sent my note to Ball and I will be curious as to their thoughts.
Hi, Scott!

I do like your suggestion and it would be really interesting to know what the guys at Ball would think. If they pay any attention to your recommendations then we'll know they take their customers seriously and that would make them a truly great brand.

I know the watch is on their main website, but is it already out in the market? If not, then is the photo on the website just a prototype?

I can't wait!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
444 Posts
I don't think there is any question as to whether Ball listens to us or not. I'm sure no company could (or would) try to keep making changes to their product for every Tom, Dick or Harry. I only hope that they make the right decisions and then stick to them to retain the integrity of the product. Just like that movie (build it and they will come) is true. Keep to your game plan and we will continue to buy your product. You can't keep everyone happy all the time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
94 Posts
I don't think there is any question as to whether Ball listens to us or not. I'm sure no company could (or would) try to keep making changes to their product for every Tom, Dick or Harry. I only hope that they make the right decisions and then stick to them to retain the integrity of the product. Just like that movie (build it and they will come) is true. Keep to your game plan and we will continue to buy your product. You can't keep everyone happy all the time.
You have a point too, Groundhog. Very well put.
I noticed the discussion in another thread regarding changes suddenly made to the Night Train. I guess, in that regard, sudden changes may not be good because it could give the impression that the brand lacks confidence.

In any case, forums such as these are very helpful (to me, especially, since i know squat about watches). It's great to hang around here and learn from Ball fans of all walks of life.

Cheers!
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top