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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)

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Re: Need help w/Bitunia watch and ladies 1871 pocketwatch

I think that one won't be able to tell you much without some movement pictures - and for that you would have to open the watches up. Both probably have generic movements of some type so the make is less important than the maker of the movement.

Hartmut Richter
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Re: Need help w/Bitunia watch and ladies 1871 pocketwatch

There are many pictures posted on the link I supplied, but it might be better if I put them here:

Here are pics of the ladies pocketwatch. The case appears to be silver. It has a ladies name and Feb. 7th. 1891 engraved inside. On the movement there appears to be "S+P" and "243" below that. There also seems to be "S+P" with "0800" below it stamped inside the clamshell. S/N(?) "51258" also stamped inside the clamshell. There is also a wildlife engraving outside, with what appears to be a Rose Gold bird above a Rose Gold nest. Not sure if the Fob originally came with the watch or not.

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Re: Need help w/Bitunia watch and ladies 1871 pocketwatch-UPDATED W/Pictures

Here are pics of the Bitunia watch:

On the caseback, it says: "FONDACIER INOXYDABLE SWISS MADE"

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And a nice Bulova ladies watch I have:
On the back of the caseback, "Bulova M1 10L Rolled Gold Plate" & S/N F539491
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Re: Need help w/Bitunia watch and ladies 1871 pocketwatch-UPDATED W/Pictures

Well, the pendant watch has a movement I can't identify, I'm afraid. The other two will have ladies "form" (i.e.: non round) movements. Bitunia was registered by no less than three companies as a brand:

1. United Watch Factories P.V.B.A, Antwerpen (Belgium)
2. Mustang Watch SA, Geneva
3. Restawa Watch / H. Stämpfli & Co, Grenchen

So, take your pick. If you can open the watch up, an inscription on the inner back cover or the movement might lead to more but there is no guarantee of this.

Hartmut Richter
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Hartmut...thank you for the help!

I will open the back of the Bitunia to see if I can find some additional information.

Would there be anyone else that can tell me more about the pocket watch? Does the "S+P" & "243" on the movement mean anything? How about the "S+P" with "0800" under it inside the caseback. Do any of these markings mean anything?

I am interested in selling it, but I would like to get additional information before I do so.

Thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Have some close-up pics of the Bitunia watch. There were no markings inside the caseback.

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This is a cropped closeup. There is "Z2" & "SWISS MADE" on the bottom left curving upward. Above the main gear it say "17 JEWELS SEVENTEEN"
BituniaMovement_zps928bc7de.jpg
You should be able to open up both photos...one may be clearer than the other.
 

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The cross looks like a swiss patent cross, but I've never seen it with the S+P around it before. But as it happens, there IS a swiss patent #243 that relates to watches: Espacenet - Original document

It appears to deal with the keyless works, and was filed in 1891 by Mdm Jean Aegler. That's an auspicious name, since the Aegler factory was one of the early suppliers to Rolex (not to mention Gruen). But I can't tell you if this particular Aegler is associated.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for the additional information on the pocketwatch.

Can anyone provide me with some insight on the Bitunia movement pictures?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
While taking more photos inside of the case back (of the pocket watch), I discovered what I think is a trademark stamp. I have tried taking photos, but it is too small for my camera to pick up. I can see it fairly clearly under a loupe...it is in a Chevron shape and has a bird inside...maybe a turkey, quail, pheasant, peacock or chukar? I looked through all the pages of the mikrolisk website, but was unable to find it there.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
YES! It's the silver 800 Wood Grouse...the fourth trademark! Do you have additional information? I have it up for sale right now and would like to tell prospective buyers more about it. Thanks!
 

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There ought to be a very small number inside the hallmark which will identify the case maker, but you'll probably need a good loupe to make it out. Beyond that, all it tells you is that the case is 80% pure silver (which is a "coin" level of silver, as opposed to sterling's 92.5%), and that it was produced (and hallmarked) in Switzerland for export.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
There ought to be a very small number inside the hallmark which will identify the case maker, but you'll probably need a good loupe to make it out. Beyond that, all it tells you is that the case is 80% pure silver (which is a "coin" level of silver, as opposed to sterling's 92.5%), and that it was produced (and hallmarked) in Switzerland for export.
Hmmm...I don't see a number, bet there appears to be a "M" above the neck of the grouse...where the "X" is on your hallmark info. Would that indicate who the manufacturer is?
 

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Sorry, got my era's mixed up. The letter code indicates the assayers office where the case was hallmarked; in this case, it was done in Basel Aeroport. Presumably, the case maker would have been from that area.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks for everyone's help. I have it up for auction on ebay if anyone is interested. I can post the link, but I want to check the rules to see if that is allowed here. Thanks again!
 
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