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This may be a newbie question, but do all quartz movement seconds hands travel 1 second at a time? Are there any "sweeping" movements?
 

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from the Omega range:

Beta 21 Electroquartz has a sweep second, arguably the first and certainly one of the first production HEQ!

Other Omegas include F300 models but I don't think you can really class them as quartz as they ran on tuning forks!

Cheers
 

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JLC's Mechaquartz and Heuer's 3000 chrono both tick at faster than 1 per second... this is because folks wanted their chronographs to tick faster.

In mechanical watches, the ability to tick at one twitch per second was considered a grand complication and some of the high end vendors made them ... but they were expensive and are not made by anyone anymore, AFAIK.

I point out again none of the current mechanical watches 'sweep'... they tick too... most commonly at 8 ticks/sec but some rare ones at 10 ticks/second.
 

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In the 1950's, Rolex Made One That "Ticked" Every Second

in the 1950's, Rolex made a watch in which the second hand jumped every second . . . very complex mechanism . . . very difficult to get parts and service now. after making this model, they gave up on the idea fairly quickly.

Jeff
 

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Re: In the 1950's, Rolex Made One That "Ticked" Every Second

In mechanical watches, the ability to tick at one twitch per second was considered a grand complication and some of the high end vendors made them ... but they were expensive and are not made by anyone anymore, AFAIK.
in the 1950's, Rolex made a watch in which the second hand jumped every second . . . very complex mechanism . . . very difficult to get parts and service now. after making this model, they gave up on the idea fairly quickly.

Jeff
The complication is known as "Dead-beat" seconds. BTW, Omega recently sold a very rare example from the '60's of their own at Omegamania, for a tidy sum.
 

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Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

your reference to "dead beat" reminds me that the Rolex model (or technology) was called "True Beat". Doxa also made one with "jumping seconds".

Jeff
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

your reference to "dead beat" reminds me that the Rolex model (or technology) was called "True Beat". Doxa also made one with "jumping seconds".

Jeff
Now that almost all quartz movements have dead-beat second hands, many mechanical enthusiasts look down on such behavior. Personally, I like the once per second movement........ my only criticism is that most of them miss the tick marks for at least part of each rev. Even the A 660 does, though the cheaper E 510 is on the money. Does anyone know why there is this strange contradiction?
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

Now that almost all quartz movements have dead-beat second hands, many mechanical enthusiasts look down on such behavior. Personally, I like the once per second movement........ my only criticism is that most of them miss the tick marks for at least part of each rev. Even the A 660 does, though the cheaper E 510 is on the money. Does anyone know why there is this strange contradiction?
The error comes from gear train problems. Once you isolate every hand into it's own stepper motor, the problem vanishes. That is one of the reasons the Exceed is so nice. But I have other watches that hit it dead on and some are Etas.

Just as aggravating to me is the problems hacking and getting the second and minute hand to synch. I have an ETA 2892-A2 where the gear lag is so bad you have to set the minute hand to about 40 seconds ahead of the stopped second hand. The second hand starts on the hack and the minute hand starts moving 40 seconds later. After that it is fine...

OK, I admit, this is only a discussion I could have in HEQ... else where people would make fun of me :-d

Just for full disclosure, on the aforementioned watch, the 2892 is also driving a chronograph module so I tend to cut it some slack (TAG Heuer Aquaracer Chronograph). It is "the little engine that could" :)
 

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The Reason for the Ticking (or Clicking) -- Saving Power

this has been an interesting discussion, but maybe we have all forgotten to mention the reason why manufacturers choose to make the quartz watches "click" or "tick", in one second intervals, rather than in 1/5 or 1/10 second intervals. It's all about power consumption. Of course, the modern-day makers of quartz watches could make the second hand move every 1/5 or 1/10 second (to achieve more of a sweep effect), but it takes far more power to move the second hand 300 (or 600) times per minute than it does to move it the second hand only 60 times per minute. yes, the distance moved would be the same, but the power requirements are very different.

Jeff
 

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Re: The Reason for the Ticking (or Clicking) -- Saving Power

this has been an interesting discussion, but maybe we have all forgotten to mention the reason why manufacturers choose to make the quartz watches "click" or "tick", in one second intervals, rather than in 1/5 or 1/10 second intervals. It's all about power consumption. Of course, the modern-day makers of quartz watches could make the second hand move every 1/5 or 1/10 second (to achieve more of a sweep effect), but it takes far more power to move the second hand 300 (or 600) times per minute than it does to move it the second hand only 60 times per minute. yes, the distance moved would be the same, but the power requirements are very different.

Jeff
Interesting point, Jeff. I wonder just what the power requirements would be to get the second hand to move every 1/8 sec., for example. How much reduction in battery life would this cause? Conversely, could we extend battery life significantly by having the second hand tick every 2 seconds? I don't think I would necessarily want that, but it would be interesting to know. Personally, I'm with Artec: I like the one tick per second better than a sweeping second hand.
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

The error comes from gear train problems. Once you isolate every hand into it's own stepper motor, the problem vanishes. That is one of the reasons the Exceed is so nice. But I have other watches that hit it dead on and some are Etas.

Just as aggravating to me is the problems hacking and getting the second and minute hand to synch. I have an ETA 2892-A2 where the gear lag is so bad you have to set the minute hand to about 40 seconds ahead of the stopped second hand. The second hand starts on the hack and the minute hand starts moving 40 seconds later. After that it is fine...

OK, I admit, this is only a discussion I could have in HEQ... else where people would make fun of me :-d

Just for full disclosure, on the aforementioned watch, the 2892 is also driving a chronograph module so I tend to cut it some slack (TAG Heuer Aquaracer Chronograph). It is "the little engine that could" :)
You're probably right about the gear train but I don't see how that works. On my The Citizen the second hand is on the money between about 11 o'clock and about 4 o'clock. At about 4 it starts to lead the tick marks and at the worst, by about 8 o'clock, it's almost half a second ahead. Then it drops back to dead-on at 11. And it's always like that....... never varies. It doesn't matter which way up the watch is or what time of day it is. If it were gear lash, wouldn't the error be more random? Yet it can't be irregular spacing of the marks, so I've given up. As long as it's right at 12, so that I can keep an eye on its time-keeping, I forgive it.

The only chronographs I've got are digital (a radio-controlled Citizen, a radio-controlled Junghans and my Breitling Aerospace), so I am not stuck with your hacking problem. I think that would drive me made and I'd be inclined to see how far I could throw it.

Off the subject, I'm having a hell of a fight over my Junghans. It stopped getting the radio signal and the only Junghans repair service hasn't got a bloody clue. I'm trying to get them to send it back to Germany but so far without success.

I entirely agree that this the only place we could talk like this...... and I'm very pleased that there are enough of us to be able to find some-one who understands!
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

Off the subject, I'm having a hell of a fight over my Junghans. It stopped getting the radio signal and the only Junghans repair service hasn't got a bloody clue. I'm trying to get them to send it back to Germany but so far without success.
Is the repair service you sent it to (or called about it) the Providence Watch Hospital? If not, I'd give them a call, or just bite the bullet and send it to them for them to fix it. Their phone number is 1-877-203-0542, and their email address is: [email protected]. Best of luck with it. I have one of the Junghans solar ceramic models, and it has been perfect in every way for several years now.
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

You're probably right about the gear train but I don't see how that works. On my The Citizen the second hand is on the money between about 11 o'clock and about 4 o'clock. At about 4 it starts to lead the tick marks and at the worst, by about 8 o'clock, it's almost half a second ahead. Then it drops back to dead-on at 11. And it's always like that....... never varies. It doesn't matter which way up the watch is or what time of day it is. If it were gear lash, wouldn't the error be more random? Yet it can't be irregular spacing of the marks, so I've given up. As long as it's right at 12, so that I can keep an eye on its time-keeping, I forgive it.
Could it be that it has an odd ratio in the gear train and runs with maybe 86,401 seconds per day, rather than 86,400 per day. It sounds to me like there is an extra second in there somewhere. Citizen may have done this as a small joke maybe?
 

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Didn't Seiko used to make a quartz wristwatch movement with a smooth sweeping second hand (like their quartz clocks)? I recall it's discontinued now.

Spring Drive has a completely smooth sweeping second hand of course.
 

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JLC's Mechaquartz and Heuer's 3000 chrono both tick at faster than 1 per second... this is because folks wanted their chronographs to tick faster.

In mechanical watches, the ability to tick at one twitch per second was considered a grand complication and some of the high end vendors made them ... but they were expensive and are not made by anyone anymore, AFAIK.

I point out again none of the current mechanical watches 'sweep'... they tick too... most commonly at 8 ticks/sec but some rare ones at 10 ticks/second.
This is very interesting, Eeeb. So what looks like a smooth uninterrupted motion is just very rapid ticks--like 8 ticks/sec.--that to our eye appear to constitute completely smooth movement. Isn't it curious and somewhat ironic that the one tick/sec. was a goal of earlier mechanical watches (it does have its advantages for very precise timing), but is now seen by mechanical watch-owners as a disadvantage in quartz watches!
 

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Didn't Seiko used to make a quartz wristwatch movement with a smooth sweeping second hand (like their quartz clocks)? I recall it's discontinued now.

Spring Drive has a completely smooth sweeping second hand of course.
I believe the model you are referring to was a chronograph model featuring the 7T32 module (I think), that had a sweeping chronograph seconds hand, similar to JLC/IWC Mechaquartz watches.
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

Is the repair service you sent it to (or called about it) the Providence Watch Hospital? If not, I'd give them a call, or just bite the bullet and send it to them for them to fix it. Their phone number is 1-877-203-0542, and their email address is: [email protected]. Best of luck with it. I have one of the Junghans solar ceramic models, and it has been perfect in every way for several years now.
Yes, that's who I sent it to. They wanted to charge me $10 for resetting it and sent it back showing 7 days since a radio connection. I think they took the battery out and put it back in so the zero mark came up but it still wasn't getting a signal from WBBV. I'm glad yours is ok and I expect mine will be once it gets fixed by Mr Junghans, but the Watch Hospital doesn't seem to understand the digital version..... the Mega 1000.
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

Could it be that it has an odd ratio in the gear train and runs with maybe 86,401 seconds per day, rather than 86,400 per day. It sounds to me like there is an extra second in there somewhere. Citizen may have done this as a small joke maybe?
At one point I was so desperate, I counted! At this point, I'm so used to it I almost don't notice it and it only comes up when a topic like this is raised in the forum.

I've had two other Chronomasters and they both had some misalignment. Neither of the others were in the same arc as this one and, as far as I remember, neither was as far out of alignment at its worst, but both were absolutely consistent. I don't know if the second hand is directly driven by the pulse motor or if there's a gear train between pulse and hand, or how it works.

It's very frustrating not to have enough information on which one can even form a logical, speculative diagnosis. That's why I've given up....... the rest of the watch is so great. On the money since April! My Aerospace is 2 seconds fast since mid-May and that's pretty satisfying, too.
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

You're probably right about the gear train but I don't see how that works. On my The Citizen the second hand is on the money between about 11 o'clock and about 4 o'clock. At about 4 it starts to lead the tick marks and at the worst, by about 8 o'clock, it's almost half a second ahead. Then it drops back to dead-on at 11. And it's always like that....... never varies. It doesn't matter which way up the watch is or what time of day it is. If it were gear lash, wouldn't the error be more random? Yet it can't be irregular spacing of the marks, so I've given up. As long as it's right at 12, so that I can keep an eye on its time-keeping, I forgive it.

The only chronographs I've got are digital (a radio-controlled Citizen, a radio-controlled Junghans and my Breitling Aerospace), so I am not stuck with your hacking problem. I think that would drive me made and I'd be inclined to see how far I could throw it.

Off the subject, I'm having a hell of a fight over my Junghans. It stopped getting the radio signal and the only Junghans repair service hasn't got a bloody clue. I'm trying to get them to send it back to Germany but so far without success.

I entirely agree that this the only place we could talk like this...... and I'm very pleased that there are enough of us to be able to find some-one who understands!
This sort of behavior, where the hand is correct on one part of the dial and off on the opposite side is due the the fact that the dial printing is not exactly centered relative to the dial feet (ie the movement center).

The error comes from gear train problems. Once you isolate every hand into it's own stepper motor, the problem vanishes. That is one of the reasons the Exceed is so nice. But I have other watches that hit it dead on and some are Etas.

Just as aggravating to me is the problems hacking and getting the second and minute hand to synch. I have an ETA 2892-A2 where the gear lag is so bad you have to set the minute hand to about 40 seconds ahead of the stopped second hand. The second hand starts on the hack and the minute hand starts moving 40 seconds later. After that it is fine...

OK, I admit, this is only a discussion I could have in HEQ... else where people would make fun of me :-d

Just for full disclosure, on the aforementioned watch, the 2892 is also driving a chronograph module so I tend to cut it some slack (TAG Heuer Aquaracer Chronograph). It is "the little engine that could" :)
To correct for the gear train lag, try over shooting the correct minute by about 1/4 revolution and backing up to the correct time.

Interesting point, Jeff. I wonder just what the power requirements would be to get the second hand to move every 1/8 sec., for example. How much reduction in battery life would this cause
It would require about 8 times as much, the stepper motor revolves one-half a turn for each "tick," a three year battery would last just under 5 months
 

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Re: Rolex Model was Called "True Beat" / Doxa Also Made One

This sort of behavior, where the hand is correct on one part of the dial and off on the opposite side is due the the fact that the dial printing is not exactly centered relative to the dial feet (ie the movement center).



To correct for the gear train lag, try over shooting the correct minute by about 1/4 revolution and backing up to the correct time.



It would require about 8 times as much, the stepper motor revolves one-half a turn for each "tick," a three year battery would last just under 5 months


Lysanderxiii, I agree that an un-centered dial could cause a misaligned second hand, but if it were, the degree of misalignment would be progressive and, at least in the case of my Chronomaster, it's not. Besides, I think it if were un-centered enough to be out by a half-second at the worst, as mine is, the eccentricity would be visible. I wish it were as simple, but I'm afraid it's not. Anyway, as I said, I'm like Rex Harrison, "I've grown accustomed to her face!"
 
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