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This seagull definitely not worth $300 bucks. The fininishing is poor. Just looking at the lume dot will make you turn off....

Looks like a $80 watch, the most.
I think you are a little confused the watch pictured
The M177s is an Circa $80 watch the 816.351 now costs $300 and is better finnished than the M177 and I am sorry but from these pics I can see no problem with the lume. How exactly is the finish of the M177 poor I am wearing my black faced example right now and can tell you it most certainly is not.
 

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It does seem a little overpriced at 300. A similar Beijing will cost 100 less with decorated movement and an amazing bracelet.
How much was it before the prices went up? I also wonder if Beijing will be raising their prices.

Sent from my LG-LS855 using Forum Runner
 

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The m177s is $123 from ebay when trusthonestman has them, A similar spec Beijing is $143 from the same seller. The 816.351 is $299 from usseagull but it has sapphire glass front and back a nice bracelet and a high beat st2130 movement the whole watch is also better Finished than the m177s. On the whole Beijing watches cost that bit more than there seagull equivalents from trusthonestman.
 

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I think you are a little confused the watch pictured
The M177s is an Circa $80 watch the 816.351 now costs $300 and is better finnished than the M177 and I am sorry but from these pics I can see no problem with the lume. How exactly is the finish of the M177 poor I am wearing my black faced example right now and can tell you it most certainly is not.
From those pic, you will see the lume dot not in place(Some dot is out of the black circrle..) and inconsistent of the lume dot sizes... especially, 9 o clock, 7 o clock , 3 o clock and 10 o clock of the dial...

I am not trying to defame.. Look carefully, its really that bad. If yrs is ok, I congrat you.. But if you ask me to pay $300 for the the watch shown by the picture. I am very sorry, I will not.
 

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Your eyes must be better than mine I cannot see it. Mine is great and has no flaws at all. Please remember the watch pictured the m177s is not and has never been $300 it costs $123 from ebay and I paid £70 for mine.
 

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I think hes talking about how some of the dots don't have a full black circle around them. Although that just might be the angle of the pic and we can't see it.

Either way this is a really minor detail...
 

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The m177s is $123 from ebay when trusthonestman has them, A similar spec Beijing is $143 from the same seller. The 816.351 is $299 from usseagull but it has sapphire glass front and back a nice bracelet and a high beat st2130 movement the whole watch is also better Finished than the m177s. On the whole Beijing watches cost that bit more than there seagull equivalents from trusthonestman.
I am not sure which Beijing you mean, but the Beijing Zungu has closer specs to the 816, besides the movement which one could argue was chosen because it's supposed to model a vintage/retro watch. I also made the mistake of thinking the 1st post had the M177 pictured, but I see your review thread now. Decoration is about the same, both come with bracelet and fit and finish is likely the same. So this would be a good comparison like IanC suggested:
A better comparison might be other chinese watches, not the more expensive swiss ones.
It is now $100 more to get a similar spec Seagull than a Beijing. Before it would have been a great deal for either (better for the Seagull if you want 28800 bph) but now you could get a competing Chinese watch for less.
 

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I think its much harder to get a beijing than a seagull though, unless you are in china. Also Seagull just has more exposure here, almost nobody here has a Beijing.
 

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I think its much harder to get a beijing than a seagull though, unless you are in china. Also Seagull just has more exposure here, almost nobody here has a Beijing.
Seagull definitely has more exposure, but there is John Liao who sells some models.
edit: Thought the BJWAF site sold directly to international customers too but looking at their processing page, all the regions are in Chinese so I guess they only do China. So yeah it is much harder too :(.
 

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Regarding Beijing vs. Sea-Gull price comparison, it might be worth noting that Beijing is privately owned and therefore must turn a profit. Sea-Gull is government owned, and I assume it has been subsidized for many years to help them set the bar higher for Chinese watchmaking. Aries Lee has basically explained that the government built them the new facility in order to set them up for a major growth spurt. I imagine the price increases were intended to help amortize this investment.

Just in case anyone is getting bogged down in the M177S <> 816 confusion, here's my 816.351. The finishing is impeccable, better than my Oris or Hamilton. (...and I think the M177S is definitely worth $123, just my opinion of course.)

Seagull816Wr1.jpg

Seagull816Wr2.jpg

SG816.351.Bak1.jpg
 
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Definitely this seagull is much better than the OP one provided.

Congrat, skywAtch!
 

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The cost of the watch is fairly proportionate to the level of finishing Seagull gives it. For example, my ST8000SA has a machined dial with very intricate, sharp guilloches. I've also had experience with the m186, which is the same design, but the dial is obviously stamped, and did not look nearly as good.

Considering the huge range of Seagull watches, it would be unfair to judge the brand by any one watch.
 

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This Seagull M177S:
sea-gull-m-177-automatic-watch.jpg

It's not this Sea-Gull 816.351:
IMG_5976-1024x768.jpg

And I think that for so many ppl who doesn't know Chinese watch seems to expensive 300$ for the 816.351 but I think that any manufactured -Japanese or Swiss- watch with a 28.800 bps (4Hz) and quality materials like this grows till 400$ or even more.

A little review about the 816.351:
Review: Sea-Gull 816.351 / ST2130 | Watch Guy

(reassembling the movement :))
Reassembly: Sea-Gull 816.351 / ST2130 | Watch Guy

What do you think now??
 

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And I think that for so many ppl who doesn't know Chinese watch seems to expensive 300$ for the 816.351 but I think that any manufactured -Japanese or Swiss- watch with a 28.800 bps (4Hz) and quality materials like this grows till 400$ or even more.
I would be OK with the price-tag if they had a local service arm. If you buy a Sea-gull, you don't get that. If you buy Swiss, you do. It's not just about the manufacturing finish.
 

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I think the local service arm thing is a bit overrated. Sure it makes sending your watch in for servicing easy...but swiss companies know this and tend to overcharge massively (because they know most of their customers have no idea how much the parts cost). Its probably better to get your watch serviced by a local watchmaker instead (unless they are trying to rip you off).
 

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I think the local service arm thing is a bit overrated.
Even during the warranty period.

Wait - what warranty period?

Besides, from reading other threads, I have formed the impression that western jewellers want nothing to do with Chinese watches.

You may think it's overrated; unfortunately, I'm not rich enough.

Ordering & Delivery Terms | The Chinese Timekeeper This new brand positions on quality of finish with very little said about warranty.

When Chinese watch companies do something like this 5 Year Warranty CW360, then they will take-off in the west, IMHO.
 

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The 5 year CW warranty is rare among watches. Seagull has 2 years. Same has most Swiss companies like Tissot and Rolex. Buy it from Seagull USA and they handle it. The Chinese Time Keeper i(CTK) s a boutique brand. You are comparing apples to oranges.

I get your point, but there are ways to work with it.




Even during the warranty period.

Wait - what warranty period?

Besides, from reading other threads, I have formed the impression that western jewellers want nothing to do with Chinese watches.

You may think it's overrated; unfortunately, I'm not rich enough.

Ordering & Delivery Terms | The Chinese Timekeeper This new brand positions on quality of finish with very little said about warranty.

When Chinese watch companies do something like this 5 Year Warranty CW360, then they will take-off in the west, IMHO.
 

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I have both the 816.362 and the 816.351 (and the M177S which is not comparable).

The 816.362 is a high-quality watch with the great ST2130 movement, very accurate, well finished, and a steal at £150 on eBay (roughly $225). The 816.351 I have cost me £300 + £60 tax, so roughly $540. Oddly enough, I wasn't charged tax on the 816.362. Nevertheless, the 816.351 is twice as expensive as the 816.362.

What I don't understand is that the 816.351 is so much more expensive than the 816.362, as I would put them both into the same class when it comes to quality - they both have the excellent ST2130 movement. I even prefer the looks of the 816.362 - the arrangement of the date window and the "3" on the dial of the 816.351 is a bit odd.

Review: Sea-Gull 816.362 / ST2130 | Watch Guy

IMG_6273-300x225.jpg
The 816.362.

What might cause a bit of confusion is that Sea-Gull made the 816.351 look almost the same as the M177S. That only does one thing - water down the value of the 816.351. Also, I think it set the price on the 816.351 too high. The price point of the 816.362 is perfect and the watch presents great value for money. I find the 816.351 a bit too expensive, and of course the likeness to the M177S doesn't help.

The 816.362 is the watch I wear most and the watch I recommend to anyone asking me for a great value mechanical automatic watch. My brother wears one, too ;-)

When it comes to bang for buck, I want to see a watch that compares to the 816.362. Unbeatable at the moment I'd say.

[does it show that I'm a Sea-Gull fan???]
 

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The 5 year CW warranty is rare among watches. Seagull has 2 years. Same has most Swiss companies like Tissot and Rolex. Buy it from Seagull USA and they handle it. The Chinese Time Keeper i(CTK) s a boutique brand. You are comparing apples to oranges.

I get your point, but there are ways to work with it.
I'm happy with two. But, I live in Australia not USA. No local service. I have to pay ($24) to send it to Kevin, unlike free with CW. What happens if Kevin ceases trading?

Yes, CTK is boutique and relatively expensive. Even more reason that they promote a professional warranty service, in my mind.

Given the current state of warranty services I'm happy to gamble on buying Chinese watches up to $150. Others have a higher ceiling.

I do wonder what the impact on Chinese watch sales would be if something similar to CW's offering was available. If the manufacturing quality is good, the quality cost would be low, resulting in a nice return from the increased sales.

The Chinese manufacturers have lost the fight against the Swiss in China; how hard is this lesson to learn?
 

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I would be OK with the price-tag if they had a local service arm. If you buy a Sea-gull, you don't get that. If you buy Swiss, you do. It's not just about the manufacturing finish.
I would like to know how many it cost on a retail swiss service and on the Seagull method... i guess the price difference will be substantial...

The Chinese manufacturers have lost the fight against the Swiss in China; how hard is this lesson to learn?
When?? What I miss in the way ??
Like any new rich -and now in China there are many many rich people- the first they look for it's Social Recognition and the first to cross your mind it's Swiss and Rolex... when the rich people becomes a bit less closed mind and become more open mind and estimate better their own and national brands they will think different.
You don't forget that it's not a lost fight because never has been that market share on China till now, when they are rich and they buy like any rich people of this world...

It seems I'm a Seagull fan too...
 
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