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Hello fellow Sinners,

As some of you know earlier this year I sourced a 556 I black mother of pearl from an AD in Germany. It arrived DOA and I sent it back to Sinn at my expense in Germany where it received a new movement.

Last week I discovered the watch was not winding correctly and narrowed it down to a faulty reverser in the winding assembly. Unwilling to spend the $100+ UPS delivery to Germany again, I sent it in with my warranty card to RGM.

Shortly afterwards I received a call from Mr. Murphy who explained that they are actually paid by Watchbuys for warranty work and not from Sinn, therefore I would have to pay for the repairs myself. I was astounded because many, if not most brands have an international warranty so if I buy a watch on holiday and there's a problem I don't have to ship it around the world for repair.

Let me be 100% clear that RGM and Mr. Murphy were extremely pleasant and easy to work with, but I wanted to relay these facts to current or potential customers.




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That's not cool.... sorry to hear of your experience. I'm surprised that Sinn wasn't willing to help you out. Did you contact them directly?
 

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Yes, i'm curious what Sinn would say about this, but that's not good Sinn: you buy a watch on holiday and you only have warranty in the country of purchase from the AD???
 

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It should be international. I’ve had excellent customer service dealing directly with Sinn, Christa was very helpful. I’m very curious to their reply.

Cheers
Shannon
 
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Sorry to hear. I was under the impression that if you’re in the US but bought the watch overseas, then RGM wouldn’t cover warranty as the watch wasn’t purchased through WatchBuys. You’d have to send to Germany. So it’s an international warranty with an asterisk.

Interested to hear what the outcome is.
 

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Yeah, as above. Sinn will warrant it, but not RGM. They are Watchbuys go to. Not exactly sure how that works. Contact Sinn, you’ll get something figured out?
 

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It makes sense. To be honest, this is how I understood the warranty process. RGM was just doing work for US sales from WB.

Sinn is too small of a brand to have any real US presence.
 

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I have a Sinn EZM2... keeps it simple... when I bought it... I knew that all service had to be done at Sinn. FOR MONEY.

I am also curious what Sinn has to say about RGM.

And yes, this will have some bearing on if I ever decide to get a new watch.
 

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There have been prior threads on WUS about how it's either illegal or requires a crapload of paperwork to import these watches into the U.S. because of the mother of pearl dial. I wonder if that has something to do with RGM's reluctance/inability to service.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
There have been prior threads on WUS about how it's either illegal or requires a crapload of paperwork to import these watches into the U.S. because of the mother of pearl dial. I wonder if that has something to do with RGM's reluctance/inability to service.
There wasn't an indication from Mr. Murphy that it was anything except from whom they get paid. He was not reluctant at all to service it or to modify the keyless works to remove the phantom date stop.

My main point of refusal to send it is the risk at customs more than any amount of money.


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There wasn't an indication from Mr. Murphy that it was anything except from whom they get paid.
The question is, who is paying for the warranty work: Watchbuys or Sinn? What is that arrangement?

(1.) If Sinn is reimbursing Watchbuys (who's outsourcing to RGM), then we all should get RGM service no matter where we buy the watch.

(2.) If, however, Watchbuys is acting as an importing and servicing "franchise", taking on the cost risk of the warranty work, then we should only get RGM service if we bought the watch from Watchbuys.

This arrangement seems no different than, say, BMW: BMWUSA (the importer) buys the cars from BMWAG Germany and then reimburses local independent businesses (dealers) for warranty work. Thus if we go around BMWUSA and buy a car in germany, and import it ourselves, we've cut BMWUSA out of the profit loop and they'd likely say warranty work had to go back to Germany (in this case BMWAG owns BMWUSA, but principle is the same)

In any event, if Watchbuy is taking on service risk, they shouldn't pay for warranty work without also getting the profit from the sale. If however they're being reimbursed, then we should absolutely be able to go through them.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Just to follow up here: Sinn had no comment to my inquiry regarding the warranty. Basically you need to send it back to Germany, their warranty is only truly honored there.

I paid RGM $331 to service the reverser wheel and modify my 556 to a two position crown.

I hope this thread was helpful to those looking to buy hard to find models. RGM was painless to work with and I'll post a service review once I get the watch back.


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I sometimes think that watch buyers tend to get the short end of the stick compared to buyers of other goods. Mind you, that’s not totally true as anyone from the U.K. who has dealt with Vauxhall cars warranty will know.
 

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I sometimes think that watch buyers tend to get the short end of the stick compared to buyers of other goods. Mind you, that’s not totally true as anyone from the U.K. who has dealt with Vauxhall cars warranty will know.
I'm more surprised than anything. I bought a Mondaine in Canada and had it serviced in the states no problems. Sinn surely can offer a warranty program as good as Mondaine, whose watches trade at 1/3 the cost or less.

Many many watch brands offer an international warranty. I guess I just don't understand why Sinn would not.


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I think your verbiage is confusing. Sinn warranties their watches worldwide but you have to send them back to HQ for warranty work. If you want the added convenience of having warranty work completed stateside, then you're forced to buy from Watchbuys.

The question I have is whether Sinn categorizes work completed by RGM as a factory repair. For instance if a watch was serviced at RGM does it void the warranty with Sinn directly as a "third party" has now opened the case? Are the remaining years of warranty only valid with RGM / Watchbuys at this point or does Sinn stand behind RGM's work?
 

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I think your verbiage is confusing. Sinn warranties their watches worldwide but you have to send them back to HQ for warranty work. If you want the added convenience of having warranty work completed stateside, then you're forced to buy from Watchbuys.

The question I have is whether Sinn categorizes work completed by RGM as a factory repair. For instance if a watch was serviced at RGM does it void the warranty with Sinn directly as a "third party" has now opened the case? Are the remaining years of warranty only valid with RGM / Watchbuys at this point or does Sinn stand behind RGM's work?
I think that's @JacobC's point - there is no "Sinn warranty", it's an AD warranty:

If you buy from Watchbuys, you get a US warranty with the factory being RGM - that's weird. My guess would be, if you moved to, say, Australia, Sinn would say you have to get your Watchbuys-purchased warranty work via Watchbuys/RGM, and that's just f'd up. It means there really is no global Sinn warranty, just a bunch of country-by-country arrangements that aren't transferable. There's no voiding of the warranty with Sinn, because you never had a warranty with Sinn, just one with the AD.

In short, it would appear that practically speaking the Sinn warranty is with and through the AD, not Sinn. If push came to shove, i'm not sure that's legal and I think Sinn would have to provide coverage, but who's going to take it that far? They'll just pay the postage or whatever.

Kind of a lazy, disorganized and shiity business practice for an otherwise great company.
 

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I disagree. You can use either RGM or Sinn direct to have your watch serviced from the US but who in the US would spend $100 to send their watch to Germany when they can send it to New Jersey for $25.

Case and point is on watchbuys website they discuss both options for service under warranty... either sinn or RGM and list both options in the details on every product page.

Taking it further, RGM can’t physically service the oil filled watches and they must go back to Sinn direct for service even though you bought through watchbuys.


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It's international, you just need to send it to Germany. Fairly plain to me, just a hassle for the buyer, at the buyer's larger expense.

The real solution would be for Sinn to team up with a local service center in the U.S. so us U.S. buyers have somewhere to send our watches to without the risk of the customs problems.
 

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I disagree. You can use either RGM or Sinn direct to have your watch serviced from the US but who in the US would spend $100 to send their watch to Germany when they can send it to New Jersey for $25.
So if i buy a Sinn U1 from a Japan AD, but live in the US, and I need warranty work, I can send it to new jersey for warranty work?
 
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