I've found an online deal for a chronograph watch and I very much like the design. HOWEVER, It has the Chinese ST1901 mechanical movement. I 'm leery of the movement because I was burned a couple of years. ago. I ordered a new ST1901 movement watch and it would stop cold about four hours after winding every time I put it on. I returned the watch and the company sent me another one. The replacement watch had the exact same unexpected stopping behaviour as the first one. I returned the watch for a refund. TWO BAD WATCHES IN A ROW?

Should I continue to avoid an ST1901 movement chronograph watch? What is the long term track record of this movement?

Hi Squirrelly.
The only issue with my Hemel is that some of the pips and numbers on the bezel have been lost.
I found model paint that works for me.

I hope that Hemel made things right with you. 😎
When I researched the ST19 I didn't come across concerns about failures.
The most expressed concern was the country of origin.
I had the movement fail on my first Chinese watch.
But I really wanted a mechanical Chronograph.
It's the ST19 or nothing.
I was close to purchasing a Dan Henry 1964 mecaquartz watch. But the jumping seconds don't turn my crank.😅
It's tough to receive anything that doesn't perform.
The Lorier Gemini is a great design.
They too should surely take care of issues.
Do you mind telling the brand you are looking at?
Good luck!

 

I've been eyeing this Temporelux Racing One, it's a little more expensive than most ST1901 watches:

Racing One 2023 – Tempore Lux

www.temporelux.com

I've corresponded with Temporelux about my issues with the ST1901 movement. They claim the watch have displayed no problems after selling over 300. They supposedly inspect and test every movement received from China and assemble the watches in their shop in Spain.

I have a problem free Dan Henry VK64 and also own a number of both VK64 & Rondo quartz movement chronograph brands. I haven't yet encountered any problems with them.

 

I've got 6 watches with this movement, watches from Sea-Gull, Gull Tron, Red Star, Philyda and San Martin. My oldest (Sea-Gull) is 4 years old. I've not had any issues with the ST1901 movement.

 

My Seagull, Red Star, & actual Sea-Gull ST1901 movements have been decently accurate, and that tick remains brilliant to listen to. Have not been in the situation yet where one is so fast or slow as to need service. That could be challenging and expensive depending on where you live, so YMMV. Cheap watches and could be the (unsustainable) throw away watches. Not sure yet. But they seem to maintain decent -5 / +5 in general even after at least a few years.

 

In had a Seagull 1963 few years ago, ended up trashing it, never again.....

 

Trashing ? seriously ...
i'm looking for such non-working ST19

 

I'm a no on the ST movement. 0 for 1 with reliability.

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

 

I’ve had two. One arrived broken, the other broke after a few months.

Hard avoid.

 

TIme will tell.

Chronograph movements are complex by their nature. I have read of members here who have had problems with expensive high-grade European movements so, I guess there are no guarantees.

 

Squirrelly --

Forgive me for breaking a hard forum rule: i am offering a comment with . . .no ST1901 experience. Nonetheless i think it applies: when buying any Chinese watch -- but particularly chronos or watches with complications -- evaluate the seller carefully for service issues. Some vendors are better than others.

I would have no hesitation buying an ST1901 from Sea-Gull (official store) or San Martin for example. Gee. They are not the lowest priced sources; surprise, surprise.

Chronos in general have more problems than three-hander movements and need more maintenance anyway. Five years is the outside margin for the (expensive) overall interval on ETA 7750s for example (to which i can personally attest). I do not begrudge SwatchUSA their somewhat steep charge for doing so. It is complex, high skill, work. You should expect the same for your ST1901. Find out how you are going to do so before you click the "buy now" button would be my recommendation. The answer is not likely to be -- unless you are very lucky -- your local jeweler (and you do not want him learning on your chrono).

Good luck: it has a reputation as a great movement. I needed a three register chrono and prefer automatics, so it never made sense for me, but there are probably hundreds of lovely styles and the transparent backs reveal a lovely movement. It is far nicer on that score than my 7753.

-- gary

 

mate, watch movement servicing is a piece of piss on quality well built movements once you know how it's done, pardon my french. I understand there's a certain knack to it and you must be trained to some extent but not really if you have the tools and know how. I've got no time for 'swiss' watch industry. Seems they are really fleecing custo mers at this point, Tissot seem like a half decent brand,theres a few, Glycine, Zenith are cool but so expensive. I only buy Seiko these days but want one of these Chinese chronos hehe. My original point, you pay too much to have 'swiss' watches serviced.

 

Much is going to depend on who is casing the movement and how they are sourced. Any movement that sits in a hot warehouse for months or years is going to need servicing before being cased. Someone who allows dust or other crap into the case before sealing is also going to have more issues. The basic design of the movement is rock solid and was used by premium watch manufacturers starting in the 50’s and was used for decades by way of incremental upgrades. Sea-Gull has a fully modernized production facility where they are made. And as previously mentioned any mechanical chrono is going to have more issues than a basic 3 hand movement just due to the more complex design.

 

I've owned only three watches with this motor. No problems at all. One is over ten years old, one is eight.

As always, buying the seller is wise. Considering their price, however, I am less concerned with that feature than with a watch costing ten times their price. If the motor fails, replace it. No biggie.

 

I have a new ST1901 1963 but not an original Seagull. It's a beautiful watch but very hard to wind. I'd like to keep it but am probably going to return it for a refund. Even if I manage to wind it I guess there's a good chance it'll go wrong soon with such a resistance to winding.

 

Better ask for refund if new and under guaranty

 

I now own two ST19 powered watches, one with ST1901 and one with ST1908 (added date and moonphase complication). Both run spectacularly well, within +- 5 seconds per day. The first one I have for well over a year, and it runs perfectly, a really reliable watch that I love.
Both are Sugess brand, and Sugess is a fairly good and reputable brand, so perhaps it's worth weeding out brands that aren't as reputable, and don't buy a 1963 watch from a random Chinese brand, spend a few extra bucks on a better one that has better QC.

 

Good advice, thank you. I just ordered one from a shop that claims that they have two levels of ST1901 movements. One is engraved with the mark 'SS' which they say means 'special supply'. Apparently it's a higher grade of movement. They charge about £10 extra for it. I went for that one. Hopefully it'll be fine. But I might order another from Sugess. No harm in having a couple of them with different dials. It's such a nice looking movement.

 

Hello Guido, Before I received the watch I read the shop advert in more detail. In the ad it said that I should not wind the watch to the end where you would feel resistance. Also that the watch should not be shaken as that can break it. I decided to return the watch for a refund before using it. I didn't want to be wearing a watch that was so fragile, not knowing when at anytime it might stop working. How would I know when I had wound it enough so that it would last the whole 24hrs? I felt it was too much effort to own this watch. So, I've stuck to not buying mechanical chronos. The affordable ones are too fragile I believe! I do have a few mechanical watches that all have NH35 and NH36 movements. At least they are reliable and feed my desire for mechanical watches at an affordable price.

 

I always wind my ST19 all the way to the stop, same as all my hand winders. But I’m gentle, not cranking it hard. Any watch should be treated with the respect due to a complex micro mechanism.

 

I have had two new Red star ST1901 watches and they both stopped working within a week of wearing. I guess I'm just unlucky! I have several Automatic watches and one mechanical watch with NH35/36 movements and a couple with Chinese made movements and have had no problems but they are not chronos.

 

my 7s36 and nh35 watches have been reliable and seem to be good movements. time adjustment and winding on the nh35 is easy and pleasant to use. too bad seiko didn't put any more refinement into the appearance of the movement, showcasing it is nothing special. but time keeping and general use has been trouble-free and a good experience for me.

 

i dont have an st1901 watch but recently got a watch with an st2542 in it. it's been ticking away fine for a week, predicable behavior and all.

time setting on the watch is not that great, there is play between turning the crown and beginning to move the hands. when the minute hand starts moving, i also notice a slight kick start on hour hand in the same direction as minutes hand. the move together briefly at the initial move when time setting.

play at the crown is maybe 1/5 of a turn before hands actually move (it happens clockwise and counterclockwise), its more tedious to set the time precisely because i think that play is messing with engagement of the hands to the rest of the watch train.

are folks experiencing that with the st1901 as well ?

 

Before the hands begin to move, it could be due to the crown being slightly loosened from the thread. This small amount of play allows for that brief gap before the hands engage and start moving.

 

Why has this conversation suddenly turned to movements that are not the ST19 and how will these comparisons illuminate the matter under discussion?

 

references to seiko i agree are unrelated. sorry.

post #26 though is related.

 

i suppose i could start a separate thread about it, since no one else has chimed in here i assume the ST19 does not exhibit that behavior

 

Not that I’ve noticed. Mind you, I didn’t notice it on my ST25 either. Something to consider when setting a watch with excessive free play (eg ETA 7750) is to make sure that your final adjustment is in the forward direction.

 

concerning the topic of play between the crown and hands for these Chinese movements, i was curious to know where that comes from ? is it the gear on the crown (the one that engages and disengages) ?

this 'slack' leads me to set time differently from other movements i have. i set the time on the st2542 while looking thru a magnifier, to make sure the hands are tracking clockwise (backlash eliminated) on final setting. also with the watch i have the minute and seconds markers railroad tracks and are small.

 

I've got 6 watches with this movement, watches from Sea-Gull, Gull Tron, Red Star, Philyda and San Martin. My oldest (Sea-Gull) is 4 years old. I've not had any issues with the ST1901 movement.

I've got 6 watches with this movement, watches from Sea-Gull, Gull Tron, Red Star, Philyda and San Martin. My oldest (Sea-Gull) is 4 years old. I've not had any issues with the ST1901 movement.

i am looking at some red stars at the moment, gorgeous pieces in any of the colors they offer. could you tell me who red star really is ? .. i.e. is it a part of Sea-Gull, or another company .. those 1963 chronographs are also sold by Sea-Gull on their site, so I assume they are the same company just a sub-brand or a model line.

i am trying to get more insight into the movement and what to expect. i have an ST2542-based parnis:

https://www.watchuseek.com/threads/feedback-on-parnis-st2542-gr108-20-portuguese-style-watch.5540592/#post-57537567

it is automatic (different from the 1901), and setting time correctly is tricky because of some rotational play at the crown and also a small fraction of play between the hours/minutes hands. works fine and tells decent time, but want to compare to see if these ST movements in general have consistent 'artifacts' of behavior, or inconsistent.

 

i am looking at some red stars at the moment, gorgeous pieces in any of the colors they offer. could you tell me who red star really is ? .. i.e. is it a part of Sea-Gull, or another company .. those 1963 chronographs are also sold by Sea-Gull on their site, so I assume they are the same company just a sub-brand or a model line.

i am trying to get more insight into the movement and what to expect. i have an ST2542-based parnis:

https://www.watchuseek.com/threads/feedback-on-parnis-st2542-gr108-20-portuguese-style-watch.5540592/#post-57537567

it is automatic (different from the 1901), and setting time correctly is tricky because of some rotational play at the crown and also a small fraction of play between the hours/minutes hands. works fine and tells decent time, but want to compare to see if these ST movements in general have consistent 'artifacts' of behavior, or inconsistent.

I'm not an expert on this by any means - hopefully someone more knowledgeable will chip in too - but Red Star is independent of Sea-Gull. I think the guy who founded Red Star (Thomas?) did work for Sea-Gull Hong Kong and had something to do with the 'original' reissue of the 1963.

Sea-Gull do make their own 1963 watches. Red-Star also make 1963 watches as do a few other companies.

Red-Star versions are readily available from resellers in US (Long Island) and Europe (Poljot24.de) but I'm pretty sure that Sea-Gull sell only their own watches on their website.

I can't help you with the ST2542 as I don't have one; all I can say is that all of my ST1901 watches are consistent in their behaviour and have not given me any cause for concern.

 

I took my two ST1901 out of their boxes for a run just today. They work perfectly and keep good time, and are 12 and half and 9 years old, respectively. Say that they are new, never used. But pushers are not seized and still do their job correctly.

 

took my two ST1901 out of their boxes for a run

wore for a jog .. or do u mean getting them started ?

 

understood ...

would imagine movements like those too delicate to withstand anything more than office creature work ? ... don't know

 

They were literally used in pilot watches, why wouldn’t you think the movements would be adequately robust? Maybe you shouldn’t play football in them, but they should be fine for day to day activities. I don’t wear mine all the time (large collection), but I’ve certainly never babied any of my 1901 chronographs.

 

are you using it to measure hours elapsed, minutes or seconds ?

if the former, then quartz will be superior in accuracy.

in terms of wrist watches, i don't know anyone that needs high accuracy from their chrono on a regular basis and i don't anticipate beating on pushers multiple times a week.

timing functions on the watch are superseded by the timer on my phone when i need to time something

 

might i also suggest watches with slide rules on the bezel, like the Sea-Gull Horizon. slide rules are useful for calculating rates. but if you need a chrono + slide rule, the Horizon would not be a good choice.

 

Zero --

Hah! i looked at that watch -- i've always wanted to have an excuse to buy something directly from Sea-Gull -- but i wasn't sure that my old eyes could discern the scale in use. It is all that i can do to handle the chrono's sub-dials as it is.

I am just old enough to recall, in my freshman physic's lab, trying to squeeze out yet another half-digit of significance off the scale of my (grandfather's, originally) K&E Deci-Trig Log-Log bamboo slide rule. i came across it -- with the original leather case no less -- when i was cleaning out my Pentagon office for retirement.

I know that they are collectors' items now but i cannot bear to sell it . . .

-- gary ray

 

i think my sad experiences with the b-1 steered me towards sea-gull movements for future buys ...

makes more sense to me financially and styles are as abundant as swiss if you look around.

 

I will go out on a limb and agree with 75% of what you said.

Just to put it out there, I love Sea-Gull watches. I own many and am still shopping for more.

However, I will not say that Sea-Gull's styles are as abundant as Swiss. Sea-Gull's watch design is still very much focused on the Chinese market and their consumers' taste is conservative. There are some "interesting" Sea-Gull watches being sold in China, but they are not marketed internationally.

Sea-Gull makes most of their revenue by selling movements worldwide and I feel that it will remain their priority for the foreseeable future.

They know that their design is generally not well received in the West. Outside of China, Russia is Sea-Gull's biggest customer. Russian's sale is 3x that of the US. Go figure.

I just posted a review of the Ocean Star China Red dive watch today. Have a read and see what you think. It is a beautiful watch in my opinion, but I am not getting any response for it. So there ya go.

 

link to the review ?

what i meant by abundance of styles -- not talking to official sea-gull releases or other chinese brands that use their movements. there are other watch brands outside of asia that pop the 1901 into their rendition of a bi-compax ... they are a 'refreshing' break from the traditional styles i've seen with the chinese 1901 offerings.

such as:

Raconteur Watches

Premium mechanical watches designed in Sweden

raconteurwatches.com

this one here below, has an interesting case back etching ... but somewhat weird to etch a russian movement into the case back of a watch housing a 1901:

CO40CYB-B · COSMOS Black - STRELA Watch - Chronograph Space Watch

CO40CYB-B - COSMOS - STRELA Watch Is an advanced 10 ATM mechanical chronograph that follows the Strela 3017 pioneer models flown in space.

strela-watch.de

 

Here it is.

https://www.watchuseek.com/threads/sea-gull-ocean-star-china-red-special-edition-review.5547216/