[moneysworth]

I am well aware that most, if not all of the Stuhrling Original watch line is made in China. My question stems from shopping for a tourbillion to put a finishing touch on my collection (for now). While shopping the Stuhrling tourbillions I noticed that some make no mention of where they are made. These watches I presume are Chinese. But others are stamped with "Handcrafted in Switzerland" on the back of the case. Would this truly mean that it is a Swiss watch ? Or merely that the case and some parts were "handcrafted in Switzerland", but the watch was actually constructed in China ? Oh what a tangled web they weave... :-s

 

[GuessWho]

All of the tourbillion movements Sturhling uses are Chinese. The website actually does list the movement under the watch's description (Stührling Original - Tourbillon Collection), looks like most of them have the Sea-Gull ST-93351.

 

[moneysworth]

Guess you learn something new everyday. I thought ST-93351 was a calibration standard...lol ! Jokes on me. Thanks for the info. Got my Imperium Dynasty off some guy who needed the money... $325.00 brand new. Not bad for a Chinese throwaway. Constructed well. Nice machined lower half. And of course, the tourbillion movement is mesmerizing. So anyway, just what on these watches are "handcrafted in Switzerland". Or is it all a big lie. How do they get away with that crap ??? :-|

 

[Thrax]

All of the tourbillion movements Sturhling uses are Chinese. The website actually does list the movement under the watch's description (Stührling Original - Tourbillon Collection), looks like most of them have the Sea-Gull ST-93351.

Stuhrling doesn't use any Sea-gull tourbillon movements. All of these are Hangzhou/PTS Resources 9000 Series movements.

 

[moneysworth]

Alrighty then...

 

[GuessWho]

Stuhrling doesn't use any Sea-gull tourbillon movements. All of these are Hangzhou/PTS Resources 9000 Series movements.

I see, I saw the ST designation and just assumed it was a seagull caliber.

 

[moneysworth]

"Handcrafted in Switzerland" ??? Anybody ??? o|

 

[LCheapo]

Chinese. But Mr.Stührling personally guarantees that all the money you send him will go into an authentic Swiss bank account.

 

[Chascomm]

I haven't looked at the Stuhrling website for a while, but I recall seeing at least one Swiss tourbillon (and a few other all-Swiss pieces) in their range a few years back. I think they were trying to maintain some Swiss content (similar to Invicta) in order to boost their supposed heritage credentials. I don't know what the current situation is though.

"Handcrafted in Switzerland" is not an FHS-authorised country-of-origin designation so its meaning is ambiguous. Possibly the case is made in Switzerland, or final assembly occurred there, but unless the words "Swiss Made" or "Swiss Movement" appear on the dial, then you can presume that the movement is not Swiss. If it's a tourbillon and it's not Swiss then it must be Chinese. Also, if it is a tourbillon and costs less than about $20,000 then it is not Swiss and therefore must be Chinese.

 

[moneysworth]

I haven't looked at the Stuhrling website for a while, but I recall seeing at least one Swiss tourbillon (and a few other all-Swiss pieces) in their range a few years back. I think they were trying to maintain some Swiss content (similar to Invicta) in order to boost their supposed heritage credentials. I don't know what the current situation is though.

"Handcrafted in Switzerland" is not an FHS-authorised country-of-origin designation so its meaning is ambiguous. Possibly the case is made in Switzerland, or final assembly occurred there, but unless the words "Swiss Made" or "Swiss Movement" appear on the dial, then you can presume that the movement is not Swiss. If it's a tourbillon and it's not Swiss then it must be Chinese. Also, if it is a tourbillon and costs less than about $20,000 then it is not Swiss and therefore must be Chinese.

Been waiting for you to chime in. I always get direct answers from you. I figured this "handcrafted in Switzerland" thing either had to do with the case, parts etc because there is also a ST number stamped on the back which according to the posts above refer to a Chinese movement. Nowhere on the front of these watches does it state "Swiss made" or "Swiss mov't" but I still don't understand how they can get away with such blatant false statements if the main part of the watch (movement) is assembled in China. Amazon sells the watch I bought for $945.00. I paid $325.00. If it fails, I'll toss it. As I understand that fixing one of these will cost more than its worth. In the mean time. I'll wear it proudly and continue to mesmerize non watch junkies with its cool movement. Thanks for the info.

 

[moneysworth]

Was doing more tourbillion research. Came across some different designs on the Dixmont and Stauer sites. Movement is shown as the DG8021. Who makes this one ? Gotta be Chinese right ? I'm taking from the majority of the postings here that Sea-gull is the best of the Chinese movements. Would this be a correct statement ? What kind of watch can I find a Sea-gull tourbillion movement in ? Just curious... Thanks.

 

[GuessWho]

Was doing more tourbillion research. Came across some different designs on the Dixmont and Stauer sites. Movement is shown as the DG8021. Who makes this one ? Gotta be Chinese right ? I'm taking from the majority of the postings here that Sea-gull is the best of the Chinese movements. Would this be a correct statement ? What kind of watch can I find a Sea-gull tourbillion movement in ? Just curious... Thanks.

I was wrong about the ST being a Sea-Gull movement, but I think DG stands for "Dixmont-Guangzhou", which is a watch factory in Guangzhou, China.

But I cannot seem to find any Google results for the DG8021 movement, so I could be wrong again.

 

[Chascomm]

I was wrong about the ST being a Sea-Gull movement, but I think DG stands for "Dixmont-Guangzhou", which is a watch factory in Guangzhou, China.

But I cannot seem to find any Google results for the DG8021 movement, so I could be wrong again.

DG80 is indeed a Dixmont Guangzhou tourbillon, having a tourbillon mechanism that is visually similar to the Sea-Gull ST80 (with the axis of the balance wheel off-set from the axis of the tourbillon carriage). They also do the DG81 series with the balance coaxial with the tourbillon carriage (similar to the ST82). DG8021 is automatic.

So the Dixmont tourbillon that Moneyworth refered to was made 'in-house' by the manufacturer. From what I've seen of them, I suspect that the Stauer is likewise built entirely by Dixmont-Guangzhou under contract to the brand owner.

From the PTS Resources catalogue:

DG-8021 Automatic Tourbillon Watch Movement
Function: 2 hands 2 eyes
Accuracy: + / - 20 seconds / day
Running Time:~36 hours after full winding
Beats per hour: 21,600
Jewels: 28
Size: Ø30.00mm
Thickness : 6.12mm
3H date, 9H day.

As for what other brands make tourbillon watches with Sea-Gull movements, the top choice on this forum would probably be Perpetual. Otherwise look at Minorva, who use tourbillon movements from all the Chinese manufacturers.

 

[moneysworth]

Thanks again...

 

[moneysworth]

Partys over... We are experiencing our first snowstorm of the year complete with cold temperatures around 30 right now. Was wondering if freezing temperatures have any adverse affects on more complicated watches such as a tourbillion or "open heart" automatic ? Ok to wear as normal ? Or should I leave em in the box ? :think:

 

[rappasol]

Sorry to hijack this thread but it got me curious on a related question.

Who makes the movement for the KS "tourbillon"/open heart watches?
It only cost me $43 on Amazon so I guess it must be a cheap movement although it looks much more expensive, is well finished and has been running nicely for a few months now.

 

[tobytobes]

Sorry to hijack this thread but it got me curious on a related question.

Who makes the movement for the KS "tourbillon"/open heart watches?
It only cost me $43 on Amazon so I guess it must be a cheap movement although it looks much more expensive, is well finished and has been running nicely for a few months now.

View attachment 2016570

that's not a tourbillion I'm afraid.

 

[tobytobes]

sturhling tourbillons are from hangjou as mentioned above. seagull are more expensive.

u got a good price on your watch for 325. it's a fantastic achievement from the Chinese to turn out such a good tourbillon for so little money. bi have had one for a few years and it never misses a beat. they r accurate. the made in Switzerland stuff is all bs.

 

[moneysworth]

Guess you can add Invicta to the brands using Sea-Gull movements. All of theirs can be described as wrist clocks as far as I'm concerned 52 mm and above... Sheesh... Below is a shot of one with a TY800 Sea-Gull movement. Supposedly technologically superior. It is a "flying" tourbillion unbalanced on a cantilevered single support rather than a full bridge. I like the balanced movements better. (also pictured below) Don't care much for the teeter totter effect on the Sea-Gulls and Dixmonts. Anybody care to chime in on my above question about wearing these complicated watches in inclement weather. Thanks...

(Top) Invicta w/Sea-Gull TY800, (Middle) Stuhrling Imperium Dynasty w/ST93301 and (Bottom) Stuhrling rear.

 

[moneysworth]

Now for something completely different...