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Right, from latin then.
I thought PIE indicated Proto Indo European?
English is a silly language with too many roots... So you get things like unicorn where onehorn would make much more sense (like in the much more sensible Germanic languages 😅, eenhoorn in dutch)
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Someone above expressed happiness that the SOTC's were over. Nazzo fast! I'm indolent and dilatory, but I'm here.

I also saw someone link their 2021 SOTC with additions. I'm going to do that, too. 2021 SOTC - no eliminations.

2021 additions:
  • NTH Thresher in June. I'm wearing it right now. It somehow seems like it's similar to the MDV-106, but I like it much more. Better hands and indices, so better legibility. Better bezel functionality.
  • Luminox 3050/3950 - I'm on a slow motion quest for a yellow dial I really like. This one is fine, but not The One. I do like tritium and 60-click bezels. I wear it occasionally, though I no longer have a formal rotation.

Re: joy in wearing watches discussed above - for me, they're attractive tools. I query them for the time. I use the bezels. I like variety in what I look at on my wrist. I like them to be visually appealing to me. That's how I get joy from them. I like to look at watches on line, even ones I know I'd never wear, because I enjoy them visually. It's a casual thing.

Edit: @jmariorebelo said it better, but I hadn't gotten to his post yet when I posted this.

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... there are so many SOTC posts in WUS with 50+ ‘Affordable’ watches, and I begin to calculate what that might be worth if they sold it all.
I resemble that remark! I don't think I have 50+, though.

For me, it's an affordable variety thing. I don't aspire to a 3-watch collection. I know I'd want more variety. I will grant that I have some near duplicates that could bo away, though. I think I could appreciate quality, but I don't seem to be willing to spend that much on any one watch.
 

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Have you reached a contented place by collecting all the watches? It seems as though there's no churn through being dissatisfied with what you bought, more a case of reducing the number of purchases having acquired so many as allow you to not to get bored of what you already have.

It's interesting that we all came here to stop (stop what? impulsive, ill-thought through purchases I guess) but we all stop in completely different places.
I think I'm pretty contented, except that I really should sell or give away the ones that didn't stand the test of time. I bought affordables to test my preferences, so I appreciate the contributions of even the ones that no longer appeal - they helped me realize what I like. But they should move on. I'd have to think to decide whether I regret any of the purchases. (after a pause) I think maybe I regret the Orient Bambino Open Heart. It was a very early impulse purchase, but it did teach me that I don't care for open heart watches, so there is that.

I still have a couple I'm interested in, but I'm happy enough now, that I don't know if I'll ever get around to trying them. Last year's bashes notwithstanding, I still find the FXD and the Steinhart appealing. And my search for a happy-making yellow dial continues.

Why people come here: I agree that it's interesting. I came, I suppose, to develop my discernment about what I really want so I could avoid having too large a pile of watches I'm not actually interested in. It's also interesting sometimes to see people here projecting their own struggles on others when trying to help those others. I'm not bashing anyone with that statement. It's quite difficult to be entirely objective about anything. It's just interesting to see - the human mind is a murky place.
 

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Mercedes hands. You love them or hate them. I hate them. Maybe you can tolerate them? I can't. Yuck. Single most egregious design error here.
I hate them. But from what I've read, they were necessary in the early days of lume to get it to adhere properly. But it's not necessary now. The design error was keeping them. They're ugly. But they're "Rolex."
Shorter service interval than a Vostok. Could buy 20 Vostok movements for the cost of one service...
Are you buying gold plated Vostok movements? I'd bet it's more than 20...
 

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I didn't really reflect too much on the bashing, or the "I hate Rolex for reason X" posts. (BTW, I really like both mercedes AND cathedral hands, so there! LOL).
Keep in mind that the bashes are intended to help someone think through any negatives they may not have considered in the first euphoric flush of an intended purchase. I can say they've helped me think through and avoid some purchases I know I would have regretted later.

As to the "I hate Rolex..." I don't think that's avoidable. Rolex tends to provoke passionate responses in both directions. I think that's part of their marketing strategy. I don't care for most Rolexes, personally, but if I were to choose one, the Explorer would probably be it. It's an attractive watch.

Some of you will be happy for me. Some of you think I have bad taste. I think one of you believes my next stop is detox or a slippery slope to heroin, LOL. And all of that is OK. (Well, not the heroin bit. Please be assured that's not happening).
I'm happy for you. The beauty of watches is that there are so many watches for so many tastes that almost everyone can be happy. I truly believe that whatever raises the general level of happiness in the world is a good thing.

I have one watch that produced quite a bit of ... not mockery or scorn - those are too strong... incredulity? when I posted it for bashing. But I still smile when I wear it. So, don't take anything here too personally. We're just sumdoods on teh internets. ;)

We do not have to agree on everything. I love the fact that this thread has a bunch of well intended and honorable participants who actually care. Good on all of you.
I will heartily second that.

Enjoy a Vostok Amphibia in the abstract. In the flesh, they wear tall, definitely feel their price point (cheap), especially where the crown is concerned, and most of why they are touted so much really don't matter outside of WIS circles.
They do wear tall. And they're a bit small for my tastes, though I know not for yours. I like the crown's quirkiness. And they definitely feel cheap. I have a yellow dial one that I rather like except that the bezel is so difficult to use. It looks like one of the upgrade bezels you can get, so to date I haven't tried another one, fearing that it will feel the same.
 

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Anyway, some fibers in my body are starting to itch for another Vostok now... Ehh, so, change of subject!

Anyone here bootstrapped their own business in the past? Because that's what I'm about to do, and I'm sh-tting my pants lol. Excited as well, don't get me wrong, but sh-tting my pants. So would love to hear how other people managed it.

First few months to a year I'll probably be living at least partly off my savings. And am now looking for renting a new home... However much financial sense it makes to stay at my parents' a little longer during this time, its just not working - so trying to find an apartment that doesn't eat through my savings too fast, yet at least has some separate space for working/sleeping, which is a challenge in the current Dutch housing market...
I started my own engineering firm in 2004 with a partner. We had one client starting out - an architect had told me he'd give me all his business if I started a firm. We were going after architects because so many engineering firms in town didn't like working with them, but I got along with them fine. We did fine - didn't get rich, but enjoyed it immensely. The 2008 financial crisis killed us along with half the civil engineering firms in town. I'm glad I did it.

How we managed - savings, lots of marketing, knowing the market we were going after. Lots of long hours - the firm policy was that if you sealed a drawing after 9 PM, you used purple ink to sign it. Lots of second hand equipment. My partner's dad put up a $50k CD as collateral for a line of credit at a local bank to help with cash flow. We managed not to max out the line of credit and got the collateral released after a year or two. I enjoyed it. I was just shy of 40 when we started. It would probably be scarier now, as I'm closer to "retirement" (if such a thing manages to happen). Our mantra was: Get. Do. Bill. Collect. The "collect" is very important, obviously.

Seems like cash in the first year or so is a big deal for people. My partner was the business half, and the collateral/line of credit thing was his idea. It made a huge difference as we got rolling.

You do lighting design, don't you? Have you been feeling out potential clients? Do you have a target market? Focusing your efforts is pretty important.
 

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Thanks. I'm a lighting designer, meaning, making lighting plans for architecture and public space etc.
Spitballing here:
  • we purposely avoided public (government) projects to start because the big guys went after those pretty aggressively and our former firm did as well. We didn't want to start off looking like we were poaching clients. Also, the government projects had a lot more overhead in them. I don't know how that would compare in the Netherlands. Although, maybe as a specialty designer, you could get hooked up with some of the larger firms that don't have that in house?
  • do they do design/build there? Maybe consult for contractors who do infills and remodels?
 

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What's a CD? I'll google it later I guess lol, but not so familiar with these terms in english.
Certificate of Deposit. It's a deposit in a bank that you can't take out for some set period of time. You get a bit better interest, and they know the money is there for them to use for some set period.

Potential clients is a bit tricky. I know how the game works from working in smaller design studios here before. But since I've been in India for a while, I am a bit out of touch with the scene here. But I am on very good terms with my pervious employer here, who's willing to help me - his business is running so well he's giving away assignments basically lol, so that's a good starting point to have, and a good indicator the market isn't saturated yet here.
A CAD drafter I knew did contract drafting for several firms. Could you do contract design for your previous employer? Here, I think the contract rate is basically 2x or 2.5x the hourly rate of an in house employee.
 

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... The most important thing is getting clients- do you already know people willing to hire you, or do you have a way to reach those people? I found that advertising is a horrible waste of money, and I found most of my clients by referrals..
I ran a consulting business for a while. Never more than part time, but from my experience I'd say carpoon is spot on. It's all about word of mouth, who you already know that trusts you, and what those people tell their network of colleagues.
I'll agree that it's very important to get clients. In the beginning. But as you start out taking every client, be mindful of who are the RIGHT clients. The 80/20 rule applies: 20% of your clients will cause 80% of your troubles. 20% of your clients will be 80% of your revenue. Take everyone in the beginning, but pay attention to which clients fit in each of those categories. As your business matures, weed out the trouble makers and look to duplicate the excellent ones. I've fired a few clients in my time, and my life was immensely better afterwards. Some of the people in my current firm gripe a bit when I give some of our current clients better preference - they're in the good 20%, so I treat them very well so they'll stay around.

But, also pay attention to invoicing and collecting. I suck at that. And I knew it then. My partner was great at it. You have to have all the pieces in place to make it work. Be honest with yourself, and if there's an aspect of Get, Do, Bill, Collect that you suck at, force yourself to get better at it or get help from somewhere. It doesn't have to be a partner or employee. But make sure all those are covered.
 

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Put the stock bracelet back on the MM200 and haven't taken it off for three days- rare for me.
View attachment 16347043
I bought this watch back in November 2019 and it's thus one of the old timers in the collection. Right after I bought it I was enamored with it, and claimed I had finally found my Seiko dive watch. Two and change years later that's still exactly how I feel. I love the Turtle line, the Willard and 62MAS reissues from last year are so good, but I really have not seen any other Seiko that makes me as excited as this familiar older one does. I've strongly considered each new Seiko diver as they come out but this one is just pretty much perfect for me.

I know other people have said similar things- that after finding one watch they pretty much ignored that category or type of watch from then on, as the one they had was so good. Any other members experience that? Doesn't count if you've had the watch less than a year, lol- that's just the honeymoon period.
That is a lovely watch, alright! For me, it was the Damasko DH1.0. The only thing I might change is to have it a millimeter or two bigger. But it's still the most worn watch in my box.

Edit: Bought early February, 2019

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(you cannot lose money and make it up on volume)
An engineer I used to work with always proclaimed sarcastically, "We lose a little on every job, but we make it up on volume!" when he was deep in a job the partners underestimated.

He was a character. Big guy - not fat, just big.

This was in Alaska and we didn't have air conditioning in the building at that time. I came into his area one time - bare torso above the table, bare legs and feet below. "Uh... Bert? Do you at least have underwear on?"

At a sauna party, he and I were in the sauna with just towels. He had his off. I was getting over heated, but he kept saying, "Just wait! The women will get tired of waiting for us and come in nekkid, too!"

He was also a professional hunt guide. He always took 6 weeks off during the season to guide in his plane. His favorite client were the Germans who sniffed and asked who was responsible for tidying this portion of the Alaska wilderness.

He'd bring his plane to company picnics and give people rides. Once it was during spawning season, and I was up with him. He asked if I could see the salmon in the stream below. I couldn't. So, he tipped the plane perpendicular to the ground, and flew upstream at about 60'. "How about now?"

Had him and his girlfriend over for dinner once. He mentioned something about eating a lot and quickly at the hunting camp. I asked him if he could eat an entire piece of cheese cake in one bite. Turns out he could. I mentioned an animal I'd found mummified in the yard. He wanted to see it, so I brought it to the table for him to ID. My wife still insists that I should never bring animal corpses to the dinner table or challenge guests' oral capacity.

One day, the bosses came in and asked if anyone knew who his dentist was. Seems his plane had caught a downdraft and the resulting fire required dental identification.

You sparked some really fun memories with just that one phrase that he used all the time. I miss that guy.
 

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Sounds like Swabians, cf. "Kehrwoche."
On the other hand, this country is one of the most densely-populated countries in Europe. So our wilderness is oftentimes less wild than in the US and trails, etc. are quite well-maintained. In my experience, many Germans who have never been to America simply can't comprehend the distances involved. I knew a couple who vacationed in San Francisco and wanted to take a flight to Hawaii "for the afternoon." Drive three hours in almost any US state and you're still in the middle of the state. If I were to drive three hours from my home, I'd have definitely left the state and maybe crossed a couple of states.
He'd enjoy pointing out the population density disparity to them. I think at the time (mid 90's), the average population density in Alaska was 0.5 people/square mile. He was taking them to less populated places.
 

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I’m not sure I agree or understand why a Tudor is anything other than another watch. What is so great about them? Is it they are made by Rolex so you get that same “feeling” without spending the money? They certainly aren’t unique in any way. What makes them worth the money?
It ticks. The boxes. Duh!
You've got one friend who's into watches? That's one more than the rest of us, I'd guess.
I count @cortman as a watch friend, but he's about 2 hours away, so we've only met in person the once. Maybe he counts more as "Iknowa guy" when I'm in that area. :)
 

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@Weetabix is one of my two watch friends I know in real life. Had a great time hanging out; in fact I think you were wearing that Damasko and I was wearing the Pepsi MM200 at the time!
We'll make it work again sometime! Our baby is due in April and we will likely be in Springfield for the birth, so what better time to sneak away and talk watches? lol
I believe you're right. What's the reference on the MM200? I need to look at more photos.

Grandchild #5 (a granddaughter, finally!) is due in April. Maybe we'll luck out and be at the same hospital at the same time!
 

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I think people approach watches according to some sort of (shall we say) first principles on what aspects of a watch matter most to them. I haven't got my theory all worked out, and probably won't. Maybe it's just a minor thesis at this point. Obviously, some principles overlap:
- does it sort of tell you what time it is while being durable?
- does it keep time quite accurately?
- is the price appropriate to the factors I value?
- does the workmanship of the various elements reach a level I find satisfactory?
- does it meet MY aesthetic criteria?
- can it survive Armageddon so the roaches and rats will know the time while I am a comfortable pile of ash?
- can it tell time on the bottom of the Marianas Trench? (I'll still take it off to get in the pool.)

People have a grab bag of these criteria that matter to them, then seem to discuss with others as if those others had the same grab bag. I liked the summation @Trias did while trying to understand Tudor (and I like your posts better without spoilers).

Maybe we should compile a comprehensive list of watch attributes that matter, and we could do "state of the criteria" posts. Each one may need a numerical scale.
 

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A list of criteria is like a list of justifications to buy a new watch...
I could see that, though it's not how I meant it.
It could be but equally it can work the other way in discounting shiny new (FOMO....) trinkets because they don't meet the criteria. In fact I think that if the list of criteria are accurate and true they'd be more like that than a set of justifications.....
That's actually how I use my mental list. I developed that here.
Yeah, a list of criteria is a list of justifications to NOT buy a watch.

All we have to do is make them narrow enough and then there won't be a watch out there worth buying 😁
That's how I use a list.
"Hm. Beautiful, but 40mm. I wouldn't wear it."
"Hm. Beautiful, but 14mm thick. I wouldn't wear it."
"Hm. Beautiful... how much?!"
"Hm. Beautiful, but it's almost exactly like XX that I already have."
"Hm. Beautiful, but 3 ATM. I'm not careful enough to deserve that one."
"Hm. It alerts me to the time in Cairo - I may need to know that when the cat wakes me up. I'll buy it."
I do not like skeleton watches or open heart dials but I think they, and decorated movements, exist purely for aesthetics which is why I like them on pure (and expensive) dress watches. In defining aesthetics, Oscar Wilde said: "Art is useless because its aim is simply to create a mood. It is not meant to instruct or influence action in any way. It is superbly sterile, and the note of its pleasure is sterility." My insufferable literary reference aside, it's just pretty for pretty sake and some people want that sometimes.
I'm quite fond of insufferable literary references. Carry on!

This criteria list business - I was actually thinking that it might make discussions of watches easier - "You're a fit and finish guy, so I can see why you'd say that." or things of that nature. It might also make bashing easier by hitting the bashee's actual criteria rather than ones he doesn't care about.
 
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