WatchUSeek Watch Forums banner

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,795 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hey again everybody - thanks for all the very helpful posts in the past - I feel like I'm quickly amassing a good beginner's working knowledge about the brand and fine watches in general.


I'm interested in starting to collect some vintage pieces and see (and maybe I'm wrong?!) that original dials sell for much more than redials, even if the original dial's condition is far worse than a redial. (obviously it would make sense for the original to command a higher price if in a similar condition)

So I ask - is it even worth it to buy a redial or are they just shunned by vintage collectors and I'm going to regret it in a few years when I (hopefully) really know what I'm talking about?

Thanks as always
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,546 Posts
Hey again everybody - thanks for all the very helpful posts in the past - I feel like I'm quickly amassing a good beginner's working knowledge about the brand and fine watches in general.


I'm interested in starting to collect some vintage pieces and see (and maybe I'm wrong?!) that original dials sell for much more than redials, even if the original dial's condition is far worse than a redial. (obviously it would make sense for the original to command a higher price if in a similar condition)

So I ask - is it even worth it to buy a redial or are they just shunned by vintage collectors and I'm going to regret it in a few years when I (hopefully) really know what I'm talking about?

Thanks as always
Personally I cannot get myself to buy redials anymore, my first two vintage Omegas were redials and I started to get the itch for all original. After a while I sold my redials, and I only buy watches with original dials. Some people don't have a problem with them, I guess I am just a little picky. :-d IMO there is nothing like a good original with some patina. :)

Redial:



Original:







 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,795 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
That's for the insight! That's funny you should respond Kyle as I was just looking at your Connie on the sales forum. Tempting, very tempting!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
7,645 Posts
There's nothing wrong with a well done redial that's true to the original. Problem is they almost never are accurate. From a collector's viewpoint a redial ruins the watch - and don't kid yourself by saying "but I'm not a collector!" because odds say you will turn into one and regret the purchase. I can't tell you how many times I've seen that pattern over the last few years.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,823 Posts
Sure. Sometimes you buy a redial as a place holder. Sometimes a watch is difficult enough to find, you buy an original dial and maybe an original band, to increase your chances of finally adding a specific watch to you collection, as opposed to waiting till a perfect specimen shows up. Sometimes you're after a watch with a specific movement to complete a movement centered collection.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,644 Posts
in general I agree with whats been said above however I do have one constellation with a very nicely done redial that is one of my favorites. I try not to focus on how much I would prefer an original dial. one day I ma find the exact watch with an original and get it but as was said before -this is a perfectly acceptable place holder until that day. I have so many other watches I want that I'd rather focus on the original dials to come than worry about the redials from the past.

if your question is: will you regret spending extra to buy only original dials now? no, I shouldnt think so but the opposite may not be true.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
383 Posts
If you want to be a serious collector, the answer is NO. With a redial, you won't be able to enjoy it, you cannot show it off to anybody and it's quite hard to get rid of it. (if you don't lie).

usarmy004-1.jpg

I don't think there is any redial can match the beauty of this vintage US Army Omega.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,644 Posts
If you want to be a serious collector, the answer is NO.
so then-what to do with a vintage thats in fantastic shape except for the dial which has serious damage, not patina but damage? search for a nos is one possibility but thats also considered a franken of sorts. if you enjoy wearing the watch-sometimes a redial is the only alternative
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
7,645 Posts
so then-what to do with a vintage thats in fantastic shape except for the dial which has serious damage, not patina but damage? search for a nos is one possibility but thats also considered a franken of sorts. if you enjoy wearing the watch-sometimes a redial is the only alternative
It seems that Rolex and Omega collectors are the extreme in this - Hamilton, Illinois, and many other collectors of different brands have no issue with piecing together a correct watch. Therefore a NOS dial added to an otherwise original example is no problem at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23,402 Posts
Depends on the condition of the watch itself. If having a redial would preserve the watch, then it wouldn't be a problem. In any case, consulting a professional is definitely advised.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,480 Posts
Could my fellow Omega WIS please help me understand what exactly is a redial. Is it a dial that has been professionally restored (i.e. removing the stains, spots, rust, etc.)? Is it using the original dial but repainting the dial and script? I've seen some vintage watches that look like a child hand drawn the markers and logo. And there are some watches which are presented on this forum that are called re-dials, but look fine to my eyes. Thanks for any responses from my fellow WIS, trying to learn something new in this hobby of ours; and maybe inspire me to pick up a few vintage Omegas too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,644 Posts
Is it using the original dial but repainting the dial and script? .
ideally-the above is what a redial should be. but I suppose that a swapped dial could also count (though that should be disclosed) and the term "professional" is up for grabs as you've noticed the quality runs the gamut from childlike to very difficult to discern. As said elsewhere-some prefer a fine redial to a crapped up dial while collectors will shun them for dials with an even, good looking patina but not usually beat to hell dials. Its a judgment call, therefore whther to get a really nice vintage with a totally destroyed dial repainted ot to find a dial thats a close approximate of/or a NOS as a replacement. In either case they are both 'redialed' in a fashion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,480 Posts
Thank you for the quick reply DB! I would love to add a vintage Omega to my collection one day, but wouldn't know if the dial or even hands have been re-done. If and when I do decide to take the plunge; I'll consult the good folk here on this forum.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
499 Posts
If I had a nice piece of period furniture,with the original finish,I would not dare refinish.Same for me with watches,most all of the watches I have had in the past 40 years have had original dials.But,there are exceptions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,384 Posts
There's nothing wrong with a well done redial that's true to the original. Problem is they almost never are accurate. From a collector's viewpoint a redial ruins the watch - and don't kid yourself by saying "but I'm not a collector!" because odds say you will turn into one and regret the purchase. I can't tell you how many times I've seen that pattern over the last few years.
+1000. To the OP: What is it that you find attractive/interesting about vintage watches? For some, the attraction lies in a pristine original. Others prefer that a watch show its age with a nice patina, such as Hoi's Army issue piece.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,372 Posts
I have a collection of watches that have been re-dialed and those that are original. If a re-dial is done expertly I have no problem with the watch. My collection has no rhyme or reason for purchases. If a watch grabs me I attempt to buy it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,474 Posts
I say if you like the watch, then it does not matter. It is nice to have something original, and it is also nice to have something that looks... nice. Not all patina/damage is pleasing to look at.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,966 Posts
It seems that Rolex and Omega collectors are the extreme in this - Hamilton, Illinois, and many other collectors of different brands have no issue with piecing together a correct watch. Therefore a NOS dial added to an otherwise original example is no problem at all.
There's a very good reason for that.

The company who was the original contractor for many of the classic Hamilton and Illinois dials is still in business today. They still use the original dies, processes and finishes that from as far back as the 1910's. Really, everything except real radium in the dials (for obvious reasons). So for these watches, you actually can get them to look like the day they left the factory.

Sadly, this is not true of most Swiss watch brands. Partly because there was little interest in preserving the history of the original manufacturing processes back then. Partly because the factories tended to destroy original dials on watches brought in for service and now, many years later, no one knows how to reproduce the fonts and styles properly. Even the redials that were commissioned by Omega for the Omegamania auction back in 2007 were not reproduced accurately.

When it comes to Omega, there are some even bigger problems in that many of the original dial-making processes were flawed. Also, the term "waterproof" as it was used back then, was at best a wish rather than a reality.

Hoi's US Army Omega (Ref. 2179/2384) is typical of many original Omega dials. I know of none of these with an original dial that doesn't have some type of serious water damage and/or radium burns. Similar problems plagued early Seamasters and Constellations as well.

Hope this helps,
gatorcpa
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top