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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Apple Forum:

Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple watches? while the other brands have a neutral/formal description... Examples:

Apple Watches
Dedicated to Apple brand smart watches. The next giant leap in horology.

Seiko & Citizen
Forum dedicated to Seiko and Citizen watches. <nothing else>

Oris
Forum dedicated to Oris watches. Oris is an independent Swiss watch brand.

Suunto
Forum dedicated to Suunto watches. Suunto is a Finnish brand subsidiary of Amer Sports Corporation

Forum names and descriptions should follow the same format regardless of brand.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Because we had room and we wanted to put something. Most people
know about Apple. Apple does not need explanation like Oris and Suunto
This would be more fitting and in line with all of the other subs:

Apple is an American technology company headquartered in Cupertino, California, that sells computer electronics.

Most people know about Rolex yet they didn't receive any marketing catch phrases.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Because nothing had really changed since quartz?
That's like saying automobiles haven't changed since the first 4 wheeled gas powered cars. Still no reason for subtle advertisement, especially considering that smart watches existed years before the iwatch
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Because the robot overlords want you to believe a smartphone on your wrist is a watch.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Because the robot overlords want you to believe a smartphone on your wrist is a watch.
Which raises another point. The Apple watch has little to do with Horology in the historical context in the study of mechanically engineered watches/clock/etc..

"Dedicated to Apple brand smart watches. The next giant leap in horology."
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
OP if you don't like Apple Watch go to a different forum. I don't understand your problem other than possibly being a troll.
Not trolling, I'd feel the same way if Rolex' read:

Rolex is headquartered in Geneva, Switzerland. The leading name in luxury watches combining style with precision and reliability. A symbol of watchmaking perfection for over a century.
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Last edited by lxxrr at 14:00.

Which raises another point. The Apple watch has little to do with Horology in the historical context in the study of mechanically engineered watches/clock/etc.
Horology is the science of measuring time.

Off the top of my head, in the 20th century, the advances in horology have been-adoption of wristwatches en masse (by men, because women were doing it a century earlier) through the introduction of sealing and the improvement of glass, adoption of chronographs and automatics en masse, atomic clocks, quartz, network time protocol.

Time keeping has been computerized and networked since the 1980s with NTP. The next step in time keeping is bringing NTP to the masses-first through computers, then cell phones, and now with smartwatches and Apple Watch is the one that moves the smartwatch from a niche product into a mainstream product.

What we're seeing is the effect of the information revolution, the information age, on horology. It started on desktops and it was only a matter of time before it moved back onto the wrist.
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Horology is the science of measuring time.

Off the top of my head, in the 20th century, the advances in horology have been-adoption of wristwatches en masse (by men, because women were doing it a century earlier) through the introduction of sealing and the improvement of glass, adoption of chronographs and automatics en masse, atomic clocks, quartz, network time protocol.

Time keeping has been computerized and networked since the 1980s with NTP. The next step in time keeping is bringing NTP to the masses-first through computers, then cell phones, and now with smartwatches and Apple Watch is the one that moves the smartwatch from a niche product into a mainstream product.

What we're seeing is the effect of the information revolution, the information age, on horology. It started on desktops and it was only a matter of time before it moved back onto the wrist.
To start off, yes, the description does really feel like the embodiment of an Apple advertisement. Not that it will ever contribute to the lackluster demand it's been having or will ever have. But I am really surprised that Apple Watch even has a subform of its own rather than a general Smart Watch theme section. I will place bets that monetary incentive was involved. I only say this because last time I was here, A Lange Sohne was not given a subform of its own, but was listed under high-end watches.

Second, horology is indeed the science of keeping/measuring time. Much complex maneuvers, dedication, effort and time have to be undertaken to achieve precise control of calculation that such a field must be brought about during a period when it was a luxury to know what time it was.

Now, I am not a horologist by any means, but please, do not advance the notion that if you strap a phone to your wrist, it suddenly became part of the horological enterprise that masses have devoted for the sole sake of keeping time. This is disrespectful, blasphemous, impolite to the history of timekeeping and especially the users of this forum.

Finally, strictly speaking, Apple has done nothing to advance time keeping to even consider it in a horological perspective. While the entertainment value that an Apple device provides is unquestionably a waste of time, I cannot conceive any betterment to time keeping but that of time wasting.

Horology did not start on our wrists, but it ended on our wrists... about a decade or two ago. Not conceding, will never concede.
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

The history of this subforum is that there were too many threads in the public forum, hence the move of the threads to the smartwatches forum. And then there were too many threads there hence the creation of an Apple subforum under smartwatches, where it still is. This forum is both its own forum and a subforum-it can be both, why not?

Second, horology is indeed the science of keeping/measuring time. Much complex maneuvers, dedication, effort and time have to be undertaken to achieve precise control of calculation that such a field must be brought about during a period when it was a luxury to know what time it was.
And more complex machines exist to keep track of time in this age when time is not a luxury but a necessity. I want to catch my train on time or else be late to work-that's a necessity for me and the train system. My cell phone bills by the minute after using a pool of free minutes-that needs tracking. I place an order for a watch on the internet for a store on the other side of the world-that vendor needs to know when the order was placed, and the planes involved in shipping it need standardized time with more urgency than trains a century ago needed standardized time. I watch TV and this is paid for by advertisers-again, time needs tracking, and again, the need for standardized time, to coordinate across time zones.

Computers-the complex machines they are-are what make all this precision in timekeeping necessary. If the world doesn't feel like time keeping is a necessity, it's because of the easy availability of accurate time-time you can trust-and again, this easy availability is made possible because of computers. The more accessible a technology, the more potential for it being revolutionary.

We've come a long way from needing observatories to send the time to clock towers, train stations, and banks for accurate time. We've come a long way from needing to call a phone number or to watch the news to get accurate time. Everyone now has access to accurate time and it's been made possible because of computers, starting with reference atomic clocks all the way down the chain to the computers on our desks, in our pockets, and now on our wrists.

Now, I am not a horologist by any means, but please, do not advance the notion that if you strap a phone to your wrist, it suddenly became part of the horological enterprise that masses have devoted for the sole sake of keeping time. This is disrespectful, blasphemous, impolite to the history of timekeeping and especially the users of this forum.
You don't think that limiting horology to devices that keep time and do nothing else is limiting to the advancement of horology? By your definition, you would consider the contribution of the atomic clock-yet then leave it at that to completely disregard the role every other computer has played in your ability to know the time. Obliterate computers and where are we at? We're at using quartz watches and syncing them with time from a phone number for accurate time. Or, maybe, if you live close enough to an atomic clock that sends radiowaves, you can get a radio-controlled atomic watch or clock. I can live with that, but I would rather have even more accurate time and that comes from an atomic watch or clock, or from Network Time Protocol. And for many things I depend on, accurate time is not a want but a need.

Finally, strictly speaking, Apple has done nothing to advance time keeping to even consider it in a horological perspective. While the entertainment value that an Apple device provides is unquestionably a waste of time, I cannot conceive any betterment to time keeping but that of time wasting.
The Apple Watch gives me the time accurate to 50 milliseconds, the day, the date, world time, sunrise, sunset, the sun's position, the moon's phase, a timer, a stopwatch, a calendar, and alarms-and that's just out of the box, let's see what else software developers can come up with. It gives me the time in all these different ways, and all in a $350 package. It is far more accessible to me than a Philippe Patek I would need for the sunrise/sunset complication alone. The AW has made the time accessible to people in ways that mechanical watch manufacturers would not at prices everyday people can reach. Again, it's not a revolution unless it gains mass adoption for the masses to use-how many people have an AW vs. how many people have a watch with a sunrise/sunset complication?

Horology did not start on our wrists, but it ended on our wrists... about a decade or two ago. Not conceding, will never concede.
As Tim Cook has been saying for a while: The wrist is interesting.
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

A total of 74 threads over the span of almost one year does not quality as there being too many threads or such a necessity that without the creation of this subforum, further discussions important to WUS community/majority will be displaced.

I can understand a subforum being there for Lange as it garnered demand for a high-end market, even if how little in comparison to likes of Rolex/Omega forum.
 

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Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

I can understand a subforum being there for Lange as it garnered demand for a high-end market, even if how little in comparison to likes of Rolex/Omega forum.
Well, you could always lobby for a sub forum for A Lange if you feel strongly enough.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Horology is the science of measuring time.

Time keeping has been computerized and networked since the 1980s with NTP. The next step in time keeping is bringing NTP to the masses-first through computers, then cell phones, and now with smartwatches and Apple Watch is the one that moves the smartwatch from a niche product into a mainstream product..
As someone with a master's degree in computer science, engineer, and in the industry over over 12 years, I respectfully disagree in the correlation between a time synchronization protocol and forward movement in the art/engineering/study of horology. We know that the NTP protocol is well established and will assist in the synchronization of any networked device perfectly. That's programming, not horology. A copy machine includes the technology to make perfect images of a hand drawn painting. A copier in my view does not replace the artistic aspect of painting. The methods, training, dedication, skill required to hand paint is an art form, as is Horology. The IWatch is a completely different platform and no one is disputing that. A computer worn on the wrist can easily replicate the functions of a mechanical watch through existing protocols and apps. If I strap a band on a Ipod Touch, it'll tell perfect time. It'll still have nothing to do with art and study of horology.

The thread has now derailed though, and we're now venturing into religious territory. When just about any object/parallel/fallacy can be tied together based on how far the person wants to stretch their beliefs and defend their own. All i'm stating is that marketing speak is not appropriate for a internet forum catering to wide variety of brands. It shows blatant bias / paid advertising.
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

As someone with a master's degree in computer science, engineer, and in the industry over over 12 years, I respectfully disagree in the correlation between a time synchronization protocol and forward movement in the art/engineering/study of horology.
This really doesn't make any sense.

Perhaps there should be a new term for the study and admiration of centuries-old mechanical timepieces.

We'd have to exclude water clocks, observations of Jupiter's moons, and other old methods, though, and just focus on metallic alloys formed into gears and springs.

Then, that niche - whatever it shall be named - can be free to declare itself as the Only True Way to measure time.

But only if it's small enough for the pocket or wrist?
 

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Re: Why does the description of this forum read like an advertisement for Apple w...

Horology is the science of measuring time.
... I respectfully disagree in the correlation between a time synchronization protocol and forward movement in the art/engineering/study of horology.
Well, horology is the science of measuring time. Mechanical movements is merely an instrument for doing that. Instruments change over time.
 

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Maybe "horophile"? Nah, that sounds dirty...

The "-ology" part describes "study", not merely interest or enthusiasm. It means experimentation and discovery. The act of simply enjoying something is different from studying it.
 
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